returnofsid Posted April 8, 2009 Share Posted April 8, 2009 Hi all, Just found this forum and am very greatful ! I have a problem. We have a 89 Suburu DL wagon with a 1.8L motor. It up and died on me while driving. No backfire though. Now it sounds a bit funny when turning over, like it's turning over a tad bit too easy. I've had timing belts break on other vehicles and the sound was much more exaggerated than it is with this car. While doing some quick checks, I noticed that the distributor rotor is not turning when the motor turns over. No spark coming out of distributor, obviously. I'm thinking that it's a timing belt but am not at all sure. On other vehicles I've owned, the timing "view port" showed the crank, so you could easily see if the crank was turning. On this vehicle, it's totally different and I believe the "timing view port" shows the flywheel??? This will turn no matter what. Any suggestions on easy ways to diagnose the problem? Any suggestions on how I would go about changing the timing belt? The only work I've ever done on this vehicle was to replace the alternator and starter, both much easier than I expected!! Thanks in advance!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbone Posted April 8, 2009 Share Posted April 8, 2009 Yes, you broke a belt. The drivers side to be exact. It runs the disty. Here is the procedure to replacing them. http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/showthread.php?t=50768 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
returnofsid Posted April 8, 2009 Author Share Posted April 8, 2009 Oh wow. Thank you so much for the quick response and quick diagnosis!! I'd heard there were two timing belts and wondered how I'd figure out which was bad!! So, with the motor in the car, what other items will I need to remove, to even get to the timing belt cover, and give myself enough room to work on it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Markus56 Posted April 9, 2009 Share Posted April 9, 2009 (edited) It should all be covered in the article. You just need to pull off the water pump pulley and the crank pulley. Not sure about the power steering pump, you might not have one. Then you can take off the timing belt covers. Also, invest in some PB blaster to coax the bolts holding on the covers, or else you might snap off the nuts in their plastic housings. I did that to my wagon and now i cant put the covers back on. When I did my wagon i could squeeze in between the radiator and engine, but i recommend taking out the radiator, it gives you a lot more room to work. Edit: Actually, now that I remember it, I ended up damaging my radiator, so it is worth the extra time to take it out. Also, its a good time to just replace both timing belts to save yourself trouble in the future. Good Luck! John Edited April 9, 2009 by Markus56 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildhair Posted April 10, 2009 Share Posted April 10, 2009 If you don't know the history of the vehicle, I highly recommend replacing the idlers, and front engine seals while you are in there. (Unless you can verify nothing is leaking, which is doubtful). Check on Ebay for "86-94 Subaru 1.8 GL DL Loyale Master Timing Belt Kit". It's $90 plus shipping (from Yakima) and includes all the goodies you may consider replacing. You may get a better deal from them directly. If the car has higher mileage, you might consider swapping the water pump too (although I had bad luck with a replacement pump once, so maybe "if it ain't broke, don't"). It's not hard, but you do have to dig pretty deep so it might take a while. But you've come to the right place. I bet most everyone here has done it more than once... Roughly: pull fan(s), radiator, alt, AC compressor if you've got one (just put it out of the way) remove crank pulley, then timing covers. There you are! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloyale Posted April 10, 2009 Share Posted April 10, 2009 Hi all, I'm thinking that it's a timing belt but am not at all sure. On other vehicles I've owned, the timing "view port" showed the crank, so you could easily see if the crank was turning. On this vehicle, it's totally different and I believe the "timing view port" shows the flywheel??? This will turn no matter what. Flywheel is connected to the back of the crank. The Flywheel has the timing marks on it. And no matter what the setup, the Crank would turn *no matter what* as well. Crank drives the belt and cams. Not the other way around. If you have a motor that the CRANK won't turn, it is seized. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dcmille290 Posted April 19, 2009 Share Posted April 19, 2009 I cannot begin to tell you all how lucky I feel to have found this forum and a thread with my issues. Thanks to all of you. I have been turning wrenches since I was 8, and have never had to do a timing belt job. The rotor is not turning on 87 GL wagon, 1.8 so a quick Google brought me here. The service manual makes this look really complicated, but the directions here make me feel it's not that bad. I guess my reluctance is getting these timing marks the way they should be. I do understand that I have to remove the R side belt, to change the L side. Is it possible I did damage to anything by trying to start it if the belt is broken? Can someone give me some direction when it comes to putting it back together with all marks right, so it will run? This is our only car and I need it to get to work and back daily. Thanks in advance, David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azsubaru Posted April 19, 2009 Share Posted April 19, 2009 http://www.economysuperstar.com/milesfox/subaru/service/timingbelt.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RenaissanceMan Posted April 19, 2009 Share Posted April 19, 2009 ea82's are non-interference, so when the belt breaks, nothing nasty happens on the inside of the engine. Its really quite simple once you dig down to it. on the flywheel there are timing marks, and a second set of marks that have only 3 hashes... THOSE are the timing belt alignment marks. Start with one side and line the flywheel up with the center mark, and line the "extra hole" on one of the cam sprockets exactly vertical (there will be a notch in the back half of the cam cover to also align with). Loosen the bolts on the cam tensioner and let the spring take up the slack while rotating the engine slightly clockwise with a wrench. Tighten up the tensionser bolts. Rotate the engine 1 revolution... Repeat for other side... Get cyl 1 on top dead center. (fastest way is to put your finger over the spark plug hole while turning the engine by hand). line up the timing marks on the flywheel with what advance your engine should be set to. Line up the dot on the disty gear with the mark on the casting. When stabbing take note of which disty cap post it most closely lines up to. When you stab the distributor, try and make sure the rotor will line up with that post after it is installed. Put everything back on the engine, set the timing by connecting the service connector and with a timing light. Bolt the disty in place..... boom ur done... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrfan Posted April 19, 2009 Share Posted April 19, 2009 Remember when installing the distributor to mark it on the top, of the rotor pointing to #1, same as the dots on the shaft. This way you will be lined up when the distributor is all the way in. The rotor button will rotate around once it contacts the cam gear and will get you off pointing to #1. The rotor has to be pointing a good bit before #1 to end up there once installed. If you follw the method in the link provided you will have no problems. I did a 90 loyale as my first timing belt change ever with no problems. I'm no gear head just a do it yourselfer who basically changes his own oil. BTW, #1 cylinder is passenger side front I believe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4x4_Welder Posted April 19, 2009 Share Posted April 19, 2009 While you have the belts off, reseal the oil pump. I did this on mine, and got rid of a major oil leak and low oil pressure for about $30. It took me three hours to do mine, but that also included fixing another worn out coolant hose, and waiting about an hour for the parts washer to finish up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dcmille290 Posted April 19, 2009 Share Posted April 19, 2009 Good news, after about an hour I got the covers off the front, and both belts are OK, and not broken. So, I went back to the rotor, and it seems now that last night when I bumped the engine over the rotor landed in the same position it started, twice! I checked the coil spark, good. Now I checked the plug wires and I have a spark at the plug. Pulled the fuel line from the cab, turned key on and I have fuel from the pump. I then poured some fuel into the carb and it still won't fire. Now what? I have spark at the plugs, fuel pumping into the carb but it won't fire??? Thanks, David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Markus56 Posted April 19, 2009 Share Posted April 19, 2009 Your timing is off? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dcmille290 Posted April 19, 2009 Share Posted April 19, 2009 Checked the marks, and they line up where they are supposed to be. I haven't changed anything since it quit running on a trip yesterday. I just went out and dumped more gas in the carb, held the butterfly open and got it running, kinda. It is stumbling really badly, not knocking or anything just sounds like it is only running on 2 cylinders or 1 ? Belts are still all off so I cannot leave it running too long. I will do some more checking. David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RenaissanceMan Posted April 19, 2009 Share Posted April 19, 2009 Your timing is off? agreed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dcmille290 Posted April 19, 2009 Share Posted April 19, 2009 OK, got it running, after holding the carb wide open with the pedal, got it cleared up and a normal idle. Took it for a drive, and about 3 miles it started acting like it was out of gas. Finally stalled, I held the pedal down, got a semi idle, finally revved it up and got a normal idle again. Last test drive was great. Ran it hard and it isn't acting up. I feel it may be a stuck float flooding the carb. I'll find out more in the morning. Thanks guys, David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthWet Posted April 19, 2009 Share Posted April 19, 2009 If it is truly an '89, it should have fuel injection: throttle-body injection, a.k.a Single Point Fuel Injection, a.k.a. SPFI. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twitch de la Brat Posted April 19, 2009 Share Posted April 19, 2009 How old is the gas in the tank? If you're still having idle problems, I would recommend Iso-heet and some fuel injector/carb cleaner fuel additive. It should do a fair job of clearing up your problem. Or you could just dump half a can of seafoam in your tank. It'll do miracles on these little suby engines. Twitch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Markus56 Posted April 20, 2009 Share Posted April 20, 2009 dump in some sea foam and see what happens Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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