1-3-2-4 Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 My mother had a 98 forester long time ago.. However when the front oil seal leaked we got rid of it (before I started working more on the car) Anyways She's looking at another.. i can't remember what are the major issues with the engine? Did this model or the 2nd gen have issues with the head gaskets? I think the first gen used the EJ25D? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luvn737s Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 I have a 98 Forester and I believe the worst head gasket issues were with the Phase 1 engines in 1998. I think the design changed in 1999. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allwheeldad Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 98's are the phase I, 99 and on are phase II. Also be mindful of wheel bearings, especially the rears. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davebugs Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 DOHC 2.5 Just like the Legacy's. The next year they went SOHC. So the traditional HG issues. Baffle plate leaking issues(IIR still plastic). Never tried it but should be 2.2 swappable if the engine is junk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1-3-2-4 Posted January 23, 2011 Author Share Posted January 23, 2011 hmm So I should just go with anything 99 and above then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnceggleston Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 hmm So I should just go with anything 99 and above then? foresters 99 - 03 w/ the SOHC ej25 have the potential for external head gasket leaks. but the frequency is much less than the 96 - 99 DOHC ej25 gasket problem. and the leak is much less of a problem. you may be able to ''avoid'' the leak with the subaru coolant conditioner and or even live with it for a long time by just keeping the coolant topped off. lots of threads with info about this. but for your mother you may want one that is in good working order. so either buy one cheap with bad gaskets and make the repairs or look for one that has been repaired or look for one a little newer, 05 maybe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1-3-2-4 Posted January 23, 2011 Author Share Posted January 23, 2011 she's looking to spend no more then $2,000 for a 1999 and I told her that's not going to happen for a loong while. Most seem to still be priced in the $3500-4200 range. My only concern is I never set the timing on a DOHC I've done my own timing belt on my car and it was easy as pie (95 legacy) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 she's looking to spend no more then $2,000 for a 1999 and I told her that's not going to happen for a loong while. Most seem to still be priced in the $3500-4200 range. I got my high-mileage (well maintained at a dealer) '99 Forester for $1500 with "bad head gaskets" and a blown radiator. I put in a radiator and two bottles of the Subaru coolant conditioner and have been driving it for over a year. It's got 245k on it and it runs like a top. The EJ253 is one of my favorite engines - makes 8 more HP than the '00 through '04 EJ251 (MAP vs. MAF). Mine has the typical external head gasket leak on the driver's side which the dealer told the previous owner had to be replaced. I was going to do it but figured I would try to stop-leak first. Works great. Just did 1200 miles in it over the holidays. I haven't added a drop since I put it in. So.... yes you can find them. But wait till summer when HG's start to get bad and people are dumping them. Mine came with a repair estimate from the dealer for $3400. I spent $120 on the radiator and $3 on the coolant conditioner. I round-filed their "repair estimate". Sure it could use new front axles (clicking but good boots), and some rear wheel bearings. But none of that is stopping it from getting my woman to work every single day. My only concern is I never set the timing on a DOHC I've done my own timing belt on my car and it was easy as pie (95 legacy) The DOHC is nothing to be concerned about. It's the same exact process. You line up the marks on the crank and cam pulley's, remove the belt, and install the new one. It takes an extra 2 minutes to fiddle with the extra two cam sprockets. Nothing to it. GD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1-3-2-4 Posted January 23, 2011 Author Share Posted January 23, 2011 I don't have the FSM for the DOHC but from I remember the cams can't be turned the same way right? Or was it one had to be turned counter clockwise? I can't remember off hand... I guess she is willing to wait until Summer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cougar Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 (edited) Changes for the good were made in '03 to the Forester. If I was looking for a used one I would start from that year. This is more than what she had in mind but it is a nice one. http://www.cars.com/go/search/detail.jsp?tracktype=usedcc&csDlId=&csDgId=&listingId=56583201&listingRecNum=25&criteria=prMx%3D7000%26sf1Dir%3DDESC%26prMn%3D0%26alMdId%3D21165%26mkId%3D20041%26stkTyp%3DU%26mdId%3D21165%26rd%3D100000%26crSrtFlds%3DstkTypId-feedSegId-mkId-mdId-pseudoPrice-pseudoYear%26zc%3D98125%26rn%3D0%26PMmt%3D1-1-0%26stkTypId%3D28881%26sf2Dir%3DASC%26sf1Nm%3Dprice%26yrMn%3D2003%26sf2Nm%3Dmiles%26alMkId%3D20041%26rpp%3D50%26feedSegId%3D28705&aff=cartalk Edited January 23, 2011 by Cougar Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 I still prefer the '99 253 engine. I have no problem yanking an engine for a head-gasket job though - I would rather have 8 more HP and replace a couple gaskets..... Just did a nice '99 with 135k on it a few weeks ago. t-belt/clutch/HG - engine was out and back in in two days (heads were surfaced). It's really not a concern to me but I can see how some people might be scared off by their tendancy to leak. GD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1-3-2-4 Posted January 23, 2011 Author Share Posted January 23, 2011 you have to pull the engine for the head gasket for the 2.5L she wants an auto (yuck) but I hear if something get turns it will turned (guessing TQ) the transmission will turn into trash? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MilesFox Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 make sure the TC does not come off the engine when you pull the motor. Otherwise, you have to turn and push to seat the TC before bolting the engine, to not ruin the pump. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 Auto's are simple - just remove the 4 flex-plate bolts and insure that the TC doesn't slide out from the transmission - if it does - center it, rotate and gently push - it will slide back in..... Rotation doesn't matter as long as the TC is fully seated. What causes damage is when people force the engine in without the TC being fully seated - that destroys the oil pump inside the tranny. If you pull the flex-plate bolts before unbolting the engine and then push the TC back toward the tranny with a large flat-blade screwdriver - this is not even an issue. GD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bheinen74 Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 The 98-2002 are nice years of Foresters. My dad has a 98 and he had to completely redo the headgaskets, as well as repair wrecked damage. Even though the car only cost 500 to buy (wrecked) he has another 2+ G into it in parts, 525 just for HG stuff/Tbelt, oulleys, cam seals etc, and the other is used panels, paint, misc. While looking for parts for his 98 at the yards, one yard had 4 Foresters lined up, mostly 98 and 99. All 4 at that place had written "Bad engine" on the windshields. Another yard, had just one, and it had "bad engine", and we finally found a 01 Forester in a pick n pull, and the engine was pulled from it. So, out of 6 or so we have come across, all have had bad engines. Hard to find one selling even on Craigs that actually has a nice engine, and even if the HG have said to been redone, how do you know they were done right and with OEM stuff. I see car lots advertising them for 4-5 G all the time, and i would put good money on it that those even had bubbles in the overflow. "she's looking to spend no more then $2,000 for a 1999 and I told her that's not going to happen for a loong while. Most seem to still be priced in the $3500-4200 range." If your mom only wants to spend 2G, I am pretty sure you are going to be out of luck on getting a good one. In my opinion, if the HG is found to be bad, the top price a seller should sell for is 1500, but instead like you found, they are in the 3500 to 4200 range, around here its more 4-5g range, and for sure i have looked at some and the overflow is bubbling right off that bat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 Bubbles in the overflow only applies to the '98 DOHC EJ25D. After '98 they switched to the EJ253 and then the EJ251 - both of which weep coolant on the ground and are unlikely to show any bubbles in the overflow. As for the engines being junk - I agree that the EJ25D is junk and I would avoid a '98 unless you plan on putting in an EJ22 or converting it to run an EJ251/253. The 251/253 is a great engine when cared for. They rarely leak in my experience except with the head gasket external leak. Mostly people have run them out of coolant, not changed the oil, etc, and killed the bottom end just like the DOHC engines. They don't have the nasty issues that the DOHC engines have and no bucket/shim BS either. I have all of $1700 into my '99. It's a great machine and the drivetrain is all original at 245k. Can't complain much about that. GD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davebugs Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 Only Subaru I've ever really, really had troubles with was a 99 Forester. A one year engine by the way. IIR took 2 99 Forester 2.5 SOHC engines, then 2 2001/2002 Legacy engines to get a good one. As a side note after using the Leagcy block/heads (and Forester intake) a different timing belt was needed (a few teeth longer). I never did do many Foresters - not the same marketability for me. And I avoid the 99's specifically. The 99 Forester engine were significantly more expensive at the time compared to the Legacy's (like 1,500 versus 1,100). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bheinen74 Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 (edited) A 98-2002 Forester with a good engine is really a nice driving nimble car with tons of room. Its just hard to find a good engine in one, anywhere. That can tell you the engine was not the best to begin with. Lots of good information. Pretty much every Forester i have come across is either "Bad Engine" in the yard, or in need of headgaskets on a lot, to be good. I don't care for the new ones they got too Huge. The pre 2007 are about right sized, but I cannot justify the hefty prices they bring knowing they need an engine sometime down the road. Edited January 23, 2011 by bheinen74 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luvn737s Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 she's looking to spend no more then $2,000 for a 1999 and I told her that's not going to happen for a loong while. Most seem to still be priced in the $3500-4200 range. My only concern is I never set the timing on a DOHC I've done my own timing belt on my car and it was easy as pie (95 legacy) This guy makes it look easy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luvn737s Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 As for the engines being junk - I agree that the EJ25D is junk and I would avoid a '98 unless you plan on putting in an EJ22 or converting it to run an EJ251/253. From what I understand, once the needed repairs are done on a EJ25D, they rarely need to be opened up again for the same repair. So a good deal on a 98 Forester might really be a good deal if you know up front you're going to lay out about $1000 to get it in shape. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 25D's are notorious for bottom end problems. I avoid any of them that have been overheated - if they have I replace them with 22E's on general principle. GD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1-3-2-4 Posted January 24, 2011 Author Share Posted January 24, 2011 hmm never knew that about the ej25D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davebugs Posted January 24, 2011 Share Posted January 24, 2011 hmm never knew that about the ej25D You're kidding right? You've been here over 1k posts and never realized the rod bearings in DOHC 2.5's are wimpy? And it happens more often than it should that folks do the HG's and stuff only to get bad rod knock a few k later. If I know or suspect it's been driven through more than a heat cycle or two or has a bunch of miracle cures in the rad and a new thermostat and WP I just 2.2 'em also. Overheating + weak rod bearings doesn't make for a good long term prognosis. Not good enough for me to fix the 2.5 that is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1-3-2-4 Posted January 24, 2011 Author Share Posted January 24, 2011 You're kidding right? You've been here over 1k posts and never realized the rod bearings in DOHC 2.5's are wimpy? And it happens more often than it should that folks do the HG's and stuff only to get bad rod knock a few k later. If I know or suspect it's been driven through more than a heat cycle or two or has a bunch of miracle cures in the rad and a new thermostat and WP I just 2.2 'em also. Overheating + weak rod bearings doesn't make for a good long term prognosis. Not good enough for me to fix the 2.5 that is. well I'm not really looking at a Ej25 engine so I really had no real reason to focus on them. I've heard of other engines at NASIOC having issues with the rod bearings but I can't remember which. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bheinen74 Posted January 24, 2011 Share Posted January 24, 2011 well I'm not really looking at a Ej25 engine so I really had no real reason to focus on them. I've heard of other engines at NASIOC having issues with the rod bearings but I can't remember which. Most all of members over there consider motors will be done and blown at 150k, and they just rebuild them. The members we have on here would like o think they are just at the half life at that mileage, but the ej25d can be junk by 150k, just another boat anchor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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