brapbratbrumby Posted June 17, 2014 Share Posted June 17, 2014 I have finally purchased my first brumby (1982 model) and am looking at doing a quick and simple as possible EJ20 conversion. In my research I have seen the the project can be quite lengthy and can cost over $5000. I'm not sure if this is because people are looking and turbos and transmission conversions included or not. Either way I have decided to have a shot at doing a cheap (but not dodgy), simple, and relatively quick engine swap. I have limited mechanical knowledge or experience but me and my mate who is an auto electrician are keen and are going to attempt to tackle the feat in a weekend with a budget of only $1000! We have already picked up an adaptor plate for $180 and have a low km's 2004 EJ20 engine lined up for Aprox $650 (wiring harness, ecu and exhaust pipes thrown in free). We are looking at $100 for in line pump and fuel line. I wanted to get people's opinions on first of all wether it's possible? if there are hints, or any things we may be missing In Our calculations? Cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dinky26 Posted June 17, 2014 Share Posted June 17, 2014 Yes it's possible, at least I believe it to be. Should run like a champ once you get it up. I've not tried to swap any engines, so no advice there but I'm sure it's doable. Just take your time and go step by step. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazyeights Posted June 17, 2014 Share Posted June 17, 2014 (edited) Respectfully, not a chance. Fluids, motor mounts, flywheel & clutch parts, seals, gaskets, thermostat, hoses, oil & filter, exhaust, connectors, un-forseen problems by the dozen, radiator, timing belt & water pump, on and on... It all ads up fast. By all means do it, but preparation is the key to a really nice job. The budget will have to be expanded especially if it needs to be done in a weekend. Edited June 17, 2014 by Crazyeights 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brapbratbrumby Posted June 17, 2014 Author Share Posted June 17, 2014 Respectfully, not a chance. Fluids, motor mounts, flywheel & clutch part, seals, gaskets, thermostat, hoses, oil & filter, exhaust, connectors, un-forseen problems by the dozen, radiator, timing belt & water pump, on and on... It all ads up fast. By all means do it, but preparation is the key to a really nice job. The budget will have to be expanded especially if it needs to be done in a weekend. Great, thanks heaps for the advice and thoughts. I think what you are saying will prove to be the truth at the end of all this, but will take what you said and try to prepare as best as possible to meet these issues. We are still keen to give it a go so will keep yas up dated on how it works out. Feel free to keep an eye on this topic through the next couple days, cause im sure we will be posting plenty of issues. Cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazyeights Posted June 17, 2014 Share Posted June 17, 2014 Can't wait for LOTS of pictures. Good Luck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coxy Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 Well at least up at Wamberal, Cardiff is not that far away and there is a good early Subaru wreckers there, You will need him as that Old Four Speed will; grenade quick smart if you use the new power too much,Do not forget these things run in Front Wheel Drive on the road, an AWD conversion makes them useable or with the right Gearbox they respond nicely to locking the Box in Four Wheel Drive and modding the front driveshafts and running them in Rear Wheel drive. The Difference in handling and steering when converted to RWD is amazing as is the conversion to AWD when it comes to getting off the line uphill on Wet Roads and that is with the EA 81 engines, With an EJ an AWD is almost mandatory or or a Block of Timber under the accelerator pedal.. Live with the four speed but plan on doing a Low range AWD conversion or drive appropriately and run an L wagon 5 speed and bigger wheels tyres, Lots of Luck getting decent off road 14 inch tyres in Aus these days though, Road one's worth fitting are hard enough to source. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
el_freddo Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 Yes it's doable - but as mentioned be aware that seals etc are very well worth the effort while the engine is out. Rear main is a must! Is this EJ a twin overhead cam (DOHC) or a single overhead cam (SOHC) EJ? IF it's a SOHC it'll drop straight in, if DOHC you'll need to hammer/notch the chassis rails to clear the cam covers... As for the radiator, just use the stock unit with a piece of the factory EA hose size with the EJ hose over that done up nice and tight - much like those rubber adaptors you can get. Have you already filed the flywheel to fit the EJ crank bolt pattern? With an adaptor plate you need to use the EA flywheel to make use of the factory EA clutch. WIth a weekend swap the neatness of the wiring will be very tricky - and that's just fitting it to the vehicle. You'll need to work out where you're going to source your power(s), earth, fuse panel (yes, run an auxiliary one between the EJ harness and the Brat's factory loom to protect both from eachother); also to consider where you'll fit the ECU and it's check engine light (must have!), how you'll mod the exhaust and how you'll run a fuel return line - will you be using a "swirl pot" for the EFI pump? If you're going to cut the wiring down over the same weekend that you'll fit the engine you'll be pushing tin with only two of you with neither having done the conversion before. Get the wiring cut down and if possible do a bench test fire of the engine, if it runs go from there, if not reassess your wiring! I know of a "double conversion" done over a weekend in Western Australia - but this was a bunch of mates (4 to 6 from memory) that did everything from a pile of parts and a Friday Arvo. In my opinion, get the wiring cut down to only what you need. You'll need to source a wiring diagram/schematics for that particular vehicle to know what you'll need. I suspect you might need the security part of the wiring loom to make it work, but I could be wrong here as I've only messed with a mid '90's EJ loom.All the best with the conversion, it sounds exciting with the weekend challenge!CheersBennie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wagonist Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 As above. I wouldn't bank on a weekend conversion. I did an EA82T half cut converison in my L sries touring wagon & that took me almost 1 year. 6 months was figuring out that I'd plugged one wire in wrong As Bennie said, get the wiring sorted with it out of the car & get it running that way first. Fitting the stuff into the car is the easy part... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brapbratbrumby Posted June 22, 2014 Author Share Posted June 22, 2014 Realy appreciate all of the advice guys. Project has gone great so far. We have not achieved the aim as such but are on target to doing a relatively simple quick conversion I believe. We got the old engine out, new engine (SOHC) in and cross member drilled, exhaust welded together and fitting beautifully, and radiator hoses and new slimline fan fitted. So far we have only spent approx. $900 on the project! We managed to get the exhaust, thermo fan, and even radiator hoses for under $70. Obviously they are not as good as new but for now with our budget they will do and we will replace them when we become rich. Technically we still have one more day to use, as we only put in a Sunday of work due to church commitments on the saturday. Our biggest set backs are the adaptor plate did not arrive in time for the weekend, and no where was open that could redrill our flywheel. We have also decided that we will get the engine connected and fitted with the flywheel and adapter plate before we start on the wireing. I am far from a mechanic and my mate is really the brains behind the project, he believes the wireing will take him less then a day so I am interested to see if he can show that u don't need a whole year to do the job!. Our final problem is the imobiliser. The wreckers lost the key for the engine and therefore we are getting one made for it by a local guy who believes it won't be an issue. Awesome to hear that a bunch of guys finished a double project in a day by the way! And I would believe it possible if you had the gear. We have found the hardest and most annoying part has simply been finding parts that fit, like the hoses and thermo fan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brapbratbrumby Posted June 22, 2014 Author Share Posted June 22, 2014 Also it would be nice to do the seals while the engine is out but the engine is a 2005 model with only 100000 odd km's on the clock and pretty clean looking, plus we don't mind taking the engine out again later down the track as we have found this to be one of the easiest parts of the project. So we will leave it be for now as we are already pushing our budget and time frame Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
el_freddo Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 Also it would be nice to do the seals while the engine is out but the engine is a 2005 model with only 100000 odd km's on the clock and pretty clean looking, plus we don't mind taking the engine out again later down the track as we have found this to be one of the easiest parts of the project. So we will leave it be for now as we are already pushing our budget and time frame Pull the engine and do the seals when you do the L series 5 speed upgrade Cheers Bennie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wagonist Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 haha awesome work on the progress. I wouldn't use my timeframe as a reference too much. I was trying to keep one car on the road and swap over parts each weekend. Also, I didn't want to just have a big bunch of soldered wires beside the drivers seat so I ended up pulling wires through to the brake pedal, gearbox, etc from my existing loom. Meant I only had 4 wires joined, but it was a bugger of a job. And it took me so long I confused 1 wire only. Pity it was the wire from the coil to the ECU so that it knew when to fire... Why Subaru made that a black wire, which is the same colour as earths... I'm curious to know what you've done about your fuel system. There's no way that the Brumby stuff will keep up with the demands of the EFI. And yes, it's much easier to pull the engine out than the gearbox, even to do a clutch replacement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Pink One Posted March 27, 2017 Share Posted March 27, 2017 What are the regulations/rule regarding the engine upgrades? Has anyone had to get them complianced or is it ok? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dfoyl Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 Varies from state to state. EJ20 non-turbo in Vic just needs a phone call, anything cutting the rails, displacement > 10% over 1.8L, or turbo needs an engineering certificate. I believe Qld isn't as strict but anything that involves cutting the rails should have an engineering cert regardless of state/territory. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Pink One Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 brapbratbrumby How far have you got? How did it go? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Pink One Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 Thanks dfoyl, have you done the conversion? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dfoyl Posted March 28, 2017 Share Posted March 28, 2017 Yes, I did it last year. EJ20 phase 1 SOHC from early 1998 Forester. Almost a drop-in solution, no rail cutting. Very simple wiring. If I didn't have the engineering requirements I would have gone EJ25 phase 2 (SOHC). EA82 5 speed box, but again I would have gone an EJ box if I did it again (mainly b/c EA82 boxes are getting pretty long in the tooth). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wobs Posted April 3, 2017 Share Posted April 3, 2017 Hi dfoyl, I'm doing the exact conversion to my 92 Brumby. Dropping in a 2004 Impreza EJ20 and an L series 5 speed. Were you happy with the power and torque increase? What exhaust setup did you use? I'm thinking extractors and a 2" system with a free flowing muffler up the back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Singularo Posted October 8, 2017 Share Posted October 8, 2017 I'm also about to pull the engine out of my early forester, which has the ecu mounted directly on the right side of the engine (the ecu is a 22611af000 f9 112500-0103 denso unit). I'm quietly hoping that its going to make it easier as its quite an old model ;-) Has anybody seen posts with info on what wiring is required before I go and work it out from scratch? Based on the comments above, it might have been done before? I'm hoping to put as much of the forester drive train under the Brumby as possible, so the more hints I can get, the better to shrink the job ;-P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
86BRATMAN Posted October 8, 2017 Share Posted October 8, 2017 http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/topic/162614-retrofitting-faq/ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dfoyl Posted October 8, 2017 Share Posted October 8, 2017 Singularo, if you're not confident with electrical wiring I suggest you contact an auto elec in NSW who does wiring cut-down's for EJ's-into-earlier Subaru's - this is what I did. It then became a matter of just connecting up labelled wires to the EJ ECU (which as you wrote is a small box sitting off the engine on the early EJ20). I have his details somewhere, just PM me. For the rest of the Forester drivetrain, I used the front struts, hubs and rear brakes (minus the hubs, I used XT6 hubs), and I could also have used the wheels but ended up with first gen WRX wheels (still 15's). I have since upgraded to WRX brakes and EJ booster, which is overkill but I like having more brakes than necessary I'd recommend the EJ booster even with Forester brakes as the stock EA doesn't give good `feel' with an EJ setup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Singularo Posted October 9, 2017 Share Posted October 9, 2017 Wow, like minds eh. I have a set of early gold WRX 15's sitting in the shed ready to go. Great info guys, thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dfoyl Posted October 10, 2017 Share Posted October 10, 2017 You'll need spacers for WRX wheels on to a Brumby, at least 20mm and I recommend 25mm. If you're not planning on going 5 stud brakes there was a guy on here looking at 4x140 to 5x100 adaptors, and I can't see a reason why they couldn't be 25mm thick. Not road legal in VIC, not sure in SA. No factory Subaru 5x100 wheels have the right offset for a Brumby, you'll need to look aftermarket or VAG (or possibly Dodge Neon, if you can find them). Something around +25 to +30mm offset, Subaru is +48 to +53. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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