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Detroit Lockers, and Subaru's


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19 replies to this topic

#1 MoscowSubaruDude

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Posted 13 November 2005 - 11:26 PM

I've been wondering about these, or similar products. I have a good friend who has Detroits in his older chevy P/U, and the performance from them is absolutely amazing. I know that one of the options available to us with the Roo's is welding the diff. However, that presents certain driveability concerns. Question being: Has anyone found a locker-type diff (not an LSD, I know the difference) like a Detroit that has decent driveability. I realize that with a locker, the problem on the street is that hard corners+gas cause it to lock up, and the inside wheel goes berserk. That's fine by me. If anyone has found something like this, can it be put in both front and rear? I know it would come in handy offroad, in places where an LSD will not help, AKA with one wheel per axle off the ground. It's the only time I got stuck, and if I'd been welded/locked, I would have made it out just peachy. Any suggestions?

Chris

#2 Zefy

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Posted 14 November 2005 - 12:07 AM

from what i gather there just isn't enough room in the diff for a locker... or its just not compatable... either way, if you were to try, and succeed, you'd be the first...

LSD is still good... and you maintain drivability... if you want a good trail rig though, welding is the best option... and its cheap... just get good at popping out one of the axles... when your not on the trail, take out an axle... then there is no binding issues... and just have it in the back... if you do it a few times, you should be able to get it down to 10 mins...

Good luck!

#3 Turbone

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Posted 14 November 2005 - 12:13 AM

You would need to go with straight axles to put a DL in. The easiest way is to weld the rear diff and just run with one axle removed when on the street. Lots of us do this, me included.

#4 Numbchux

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Posted 14 November 2005 - 12:16 AM

I found that an LSD unit was perfect for what I wanted (for now), much better than open, but still driveable on-road, here in duluth (hills + lots of snow...) it's gonna be real nice!

if you must have true 100% locked, welded is your only option....thus far....think of it as a manual locker, that takes 10mins and a few tools to lock/unlock

I've been looking into this, but there are 2 pretty substantial problems with most diffs out there....
1. size, look at the size of a diff in....well...anything else with true 4wd....it's huge by comparison
2. compatability...our stub axles are bolted into the diff carrier, which means the inside is threaded, this has not been the case in the couple units I've worked with, the axle shaft is held in at the ends, and just slips into the splines in the carrier

don't get me wrong, if you find a way, more power to ya, that'd be awesome, I'm certainly trying....but there have been alot of really smart people on it, with no results so far.

#5 MoscowSubaruDude

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Posted 14 November 2005 - 02:29 AM

Ok then, I'll take it for granted... I'm smart, but others are smarter:P So now onto second question:

Where do I go to have the diff welded? I have zero welding skills, however I do have a friend who has high-school arc welding proficiency. Is that enough? or are the welds pretty critical? AKA do they have to be high-quality TIG? not sure what I'd weld, anyway. Does it have to be done out of the car? etc etc... any details would be kickass, because I'd like to get on this pretty fast, within the next month, as cash flow permits. Thanks in advance!

Chris

EDIT: Don't the axles hold the hubs/wheels on? Removing a front axle means you can't drive it. What about the rear? special trick? perhaps modify a dead axle to fit in there, just the cup? dunno, haven't looked at my rear at all yet.

#6 Snowman

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Posted 14 November 2005 - 02:44 AM

The rear is different from the front. There's an axle stub on the diff end and on the wheel bearing end. Unless it's frozen on by rust and old age, you can take a rear axle in/out in a few minutes.

#7 MoscowSubaruDude

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Posted 14 November 2005 - 04:43 AM

Any specific procedure? or is it similar to the front? bash roll pins out, drop lower control arm (except the rear has trailing arm suspension:P) yank on the doj, and off she goes? Gonna experiment with it over the next day or three, get good at it, then go find some poor sod with a welder. Any info would be appreciated.

Chris

#8 subarubuddy

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Posted 14 November 2005 - 10:15 AM

what about locking hubs? if you were to weld the diff but be able to have the rear hubs --or at least of them freewheel then you could drive it on roads and lock the hub for off-road use. may be an more possible than a detriot locker type diff. but i don't know where to get/how to make locking hubs for a subaru. :drunk:

#9 Numbchux

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Posted 14 November 2005 - 11:33 AM

Any specific procedure? or is it similar to the front? bash roll pins out, drop lower control arm (except the rear has trailing arm suspension:P) yank on the doj, and off she goes? Gonna experiment with it over the next day or three, get good at it, then go find some poor sod with a welder. Any info would be appreciated.

Chris


go take a peek under the rear of your car, you'll see...maybe I can find a pic...

there's a roll pin on either end, simply jack up the car, pound out the pins, and slip the axle off, one end at a time.

here's a pic of while I was putting in the LSD...
Posted Image

theres a roll pin on the outer end by the cv too, it just slips off a stub very similar to the stub on the diff.

#10 MoscowSubaruDude

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Posted 14 November 2005 - 04:43 PM

Very awesome. Off to try it right now, then I'm off to a muffler shop to see what they'll charge for a quickie weld job. If i have to pull the carrier, then fine, but can it be done in-car? make life a lot easier, as I'm pretty limited in my tool selection.

Chris

#11 NoahDL88

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Posted 14 November 2005 - 04:55 PM

Very awesome. Off to try it right now, then I'm off to a muffler shop to see what they'll charge for a quickie weld job. If i have to pull the carrier, then fine, but can it be done in-car? make life a lot easier, as I'm pretty limited in my tool selection.

Chris


It could be done in car, but any oil, even the little bit left over after you clean it out real well, could start your car on fire. remember, on the other side of the sheet metal above your diff is the gas tank.

I'd do it out of the car, not that much more work and the peace of mind is worth it.

#12 MoscowSubaruDude

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Posted 14 November 2005 - 05:28 PM

Nuf said:P I have no desire to see my little car go flippin rump roast over teakettle down the street. It can be drived sans rear diff and driveshaft? gonna have to to get the diff to a shop:P

#13 Numbchux

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Posted 14 November 2005 - 05:38 PM

Nuf said:P I have no desire to see my little car go flippin rump roast over teakettle down the street. It can be drived sans rear diff and driveshaft? gonna have to to get the diff to a shop:P


yea, if you remove the axles, and rear half of the driveshaft (everything hanging down in my pic) you can drive it in FWD

#14 Qman

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Posted 14 November 2005 - 06:03 PM

Stay away from the muffler shop.

What you want is a real welder. Some machine shops have them but the best place to find a welder who can weld a diff is a 4WD shop or store. They know who has the skills to weld up diffs and can recommend someone in the local community. That could also become a benefit down the road when you want bumpers, skidders, sliders or what have you built later.

#15 kingbobdole

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Posted 15 November 2005 - 12:12 AM

Not to highjack, but whats the 10 minute trick to get the rear axles out quickly? I have no slack.... you guys just pulling the diff or what?

#16 Turbone

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Posted 15 November 2005 - 12:28 AM

If the trailing arm isnt dropping far enough when you jack the rear up, you may have to remove the lower bolt on the shock to get the axle off.

#17 Numbchux

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Posted 15 November 2005 - 11:22 AM

Not to highjack, but whats the 10 minute trick to get the rear axles out quickly? I have no slack.... you guys just pulling the diff or what?


you have to jack up the rear of the car by the diff, this should allow the trailing arm to drop

is your's a 3" rear lift? that might be part of it, when I put my 4" kit in initially, I could almost get the rear axle off without jacking up the car.

also, because of the AA design, initially, the trailing arm doesn't want to flex downward....a little time in the orv park will fix this.

#18 MoscowSubaruDude

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Posted 15 November 2005 - 10:00 PM

Not to highjack, but whats the 10 minute trick to get the rear axles out quickly? I have no slack.... you guys just pulling the diff or what?


Far from it, that was my next question. Thanks for asking it:)

So now I have a different question... anyone in the Spokane/Moscow/CdA/Lewiston area that knows how to weld/knows someone who does/would recommend a good shop? Am really really interested in seeing how well she goes offroad. If I could get it done by someone on here who knows wtf they're doing, I'd feel a lot better. I generally try to do all of my own work, or have someone that I know do it. Dunno, personal preference. But yeah, it'd be really awesome if one of you knows how to weld and is within about 100-150 miles of any of those areas... I'm willin to drive, and I'll provide beer money/cash for welding supplies, etc. Perhaps a post in marketplace would be best? Otherwise, the name of a shop that you know is reputable. Thanks in advance, on both counts.

And sorry for the constant questions:P Kinda new to this whole gig, and if I'm not sure about it, I'd rather ask a zillion q's, than fubar something important.

Chris

#19 Numbchux

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Posted 15 November 2005 - 10:45 PM

Am really really interested in seeing how well she goes offroad


go for it, you don't need a locked rear to do it! Yea..it'll be more capable with it....but you'll have a lot of fun without it!!

#20 MoscowSubaruDude

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Posted 15 November 2005 - 11:16 PM

Already have! haha:P try the second page of offroad section... had an absolute blast... wasn't happy with how it wouldn't take extreme off-angles tho... hence the scramble for a locked diff. Lift kit in the works too, but that's for later when i'm filthy rich

Chris




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