robstibz Posted May 17, 2010 Share Posted May 17, 2010 Hey folks, great site and great info! I'm new to subaru's and flat fours in general. I drive a 2000 Jetta TDI with 408k, a 2000 4runner sr5, and an 86 Mercedes 190e 16v (resto project in the making). I have a 2002 Legacy L automatic, 107,000, car runs mint. I noticed oil residue on what looked to be a trans/motor mount or a subframe connector and traced to a leak from the drivers side head gasket! I'm not losing a lot of oil but I know it's a matter of time before it goes completely. I know im due for a timing belt but i'm really not looking forward to pulling the engine for a hg...I know it can be done without pulling the engine but worried about the clean surface issues i've been reading about. I'm mechanically competent and not worried about the work itself, but i'm on the fence about doing the work myself because of my limited free time. Any suggestions? I'd be willing to go to a subaru specialist or a reasonable dealer if people can vouch for their work. Anybody know of any Subaru shops in the Philly, PA, DE, NJ, or NYC areas? Thanks in advance, Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olnick Posted May 17, 2010 Share Posted May 17, 2010 Are you sure it's the head gasket and not the valve cover gasket? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted May 17, 2010 Share Posted May 17, 2010 Don't worry about it. Those engine are known for oil and coolant leaks on the head gaskets. Run the Subaru stop-leak product in the coolant ALL THE TIME - two bottles if it starts leaking (yes they say you can do that). The oil leak won't get much larger. They aren't typically a problem and I certainly wouldn't be replacing the HG's at 107k for a little oil. I have a '99 Forester (same engine) with 237k on it - forgot the stop leak and WHOA! The coolant really started flowing out. Put in two bottles and she's just fine again. . The oil leaks are much less severe with these than the coolant. You have an easy 100k before you really have to start worrying. GD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robstibz Posted May 17, 2010 Author Share Posted May 17, 2010 Are you sure it's the head gasket and not the valve cover gasket? Positive! Don't worry about it. Those engine are known for oil and coolant leaks on the head gaskets. Run the Subaru stop-leak product in the coolant ALL THE TIME - two bottles if it starts leaking (yes they say you can do that). The oil leak won't get much larger. They aren't typically a problem and I certainly wouldn't be replacing the HG's at 107k for a little oil. I have a '99 Forester (same engine) with 237k on it - forgot the stop leak and WHOA! The coolant really started flowing out. Put in two bottles and she's just fine again. . The oil leaks are much less severe with these than the coolant. You have an easy 100k before you really have to start worrying. GD Good to know! Yea it's really not losing a lot of oil so I wasn't too concerned, I just don't like anything leaking. I was figuring it would need to get changed sooner than later. I thought the coolant conditioner was for internal coolant leaks, i'm not losing any coolant (thank god), but i'll certainly try that before a HG job. I'll probably wait to flush the coolant until I do the timing belt job. I just noticed I also need an oil pan; theres a dent in it right where the dip stick goes down and im having trouble getting an acurrate oil level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted May 17, 2010 Share Posted May 17, 2010 unlike other motors, this one won't typically get worse very fast. you could probably run another 100,000 miles with that same slow oil leak. there's not much concern about it "blowing" so to speak, so rest assured you won't get stranded or anything serious. as for the oil pan, you sure it's dented? sometimes oil is just hard to read. replacing the oil pan is kind of annoying, i'd probably just wait until you do the head gaskets in 5 years and do the oil pan then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cobcob Posted May 17, 2010 Share Posted May 17, 2010 FWIW, if you're going in there at any point to replace the HG's, don't use the stock replacement ones. Slap a set of 11044AA770 (Subaru P/N) gaskets on there, that's the replacement for the WRX motor and will put a very effective stop to any HG related leakages. Don't run more than 2 bottles of the coolant conditioner, it WILL clog your heater core if you do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robstibz Posted May 17, 2010 Author Share Posted May 17, 2010 It's definitely dented, I must of nailed a rock somewhere along the way...not a big deal just annoying when i'm trying to read the dipstick. I'll probably wait for that too. So it seems the external HG oil leak is common for the phase II engines...I was only finding threads about internal coolant leaks. Hopefully I can put it off until the next timing belt is due at 210k. Thanks for the tip! I'll probably pick up 2 bottles of the conditioner and i'll start with one and check results. How long does it need to run in the system before I can wipe the oil clean and see if it's working? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted May 17, 2010 Share Posted May 17, 2010 The conditioner doesn't stop oil leaks - it prevents and stops coolant leaks. The oil leaks are of only minor concern - don't even worry about them The coolant leak is external only but you should run the conditioner even if you don't have any leaks. And at $1.49 a bottle - why not? It's approved for all Subaru engines too. GD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2.5_IMP Posted May 17, 2010 Share Posted May 17, 2010 I bought my 2002 Impreza with 88,000 miles on it. It seeped a very small amount of oil from the driver's side headgasket, but never enough to register on the dipstick. The car had records of the Subaru coolant conditioner added, and show no signs of an internal leak. At 105,000, I had the timing belt and water pump replaced, and new coolant was added. I rump roastumed that the conditioner was added to the new coolant. Well, it wasn't, and at 110,000 miles there was oil in the coolant, and I was back at the same shop to get the head gaskets replaced. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robstibz Posted May 17, 2010 Author Share Posted May 17, 2010 I bought my 2002 Impreza with 88,000 miles on it. It seeped a very small amount of oil from the driver's side headgasket, but never enough to register on the dipstick. The car had records of the Subaru coolant conditioner added, and show no signs of an internal leak. At 105,000, I had the timing belt and water pump replaced, and new coolant was added. I rump roastumed that the conditioner was added to the new coolant. Well, it wasn't, and at 110,000 miles there was oil in the coolant, and I was back at the same shop to get the head gaskets replaced. Man, just when everybody else started making me feel like I shouldn't worry about it...haha. Well I know for a fact our Legacy hasn't had any conditioner added. I'm gonna go pick some up at the dealer tomorrow afternoon and add some for sure. I'm pretty sure i'm just gonna do the timing belt myself and i'll keep a close eye on the oil leak and hope it doesn't develop into something worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairtax4me Posted May 18, 2010 Share Posted May 18, 2010 Take a look on the back of the head and make sure it's not the rubber plug seal at the end of the camshaft leaking. They like to seep with age and the oil runs right down towards the center of the block and looks just like the head gasket is seeping. Replacing one of those is not quite as big of a deal as doing a head gasket job. And they cost $3 from the dealer and 99% of the time are in stock. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cobcob Posted May 18, 2010 Share Posted May 18, 2010 FWIW the Subaru Coolant Conditioner is rebranded HOLTS Radweld. It's been confirmed by HOLTS customer service. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted May 18, 2010 Share Posted May 18, 2010 The fact that the name "HOLTS" is molded into the plastic of the container wasn't a clue was it? It's WAY cheaper from Subaru than any other source I've seen. If anyone needs to seal up a leak on some other brand of car I would still go to the Subaru dealer for a bottle. GD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cobcob Posted May 19, 2010 Share Posted May 19, 2010 The fact that the name "HOLTS" is molded into the plastic of the container wasn't a clue was it? It's WAY cheaper from Subaru than any other source I've seen. If anyone needs to seal up a leak on some other brand of car I would still go to the Subaru dealer for a bottle. GD No it wasn't actually... rump roast :-p... I knew that before I even owned a new gen. It definitely is much cheaper through SOA than anywhere else I've been able to find it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adema2626 Posted May 20, 2010 Share Posted May 20, 2010 Nice post count ^^^^^(if you don't see it before it changes it's 666.) Anyways, is it just me or am I the only one that has heard bad things about using sealer in the engine? Not saying don't do it. I just wouldn't... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted May 20, 2010 Share Posted May 20, 2010 The sealer is approved and reccomended by Subaru. And I've seen it work. It's actually pretty impressive and in the specific case of the Phase II EJ25's it stops a specific external leak that is not a concern as long as the coolant level is kept up. GD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davebugs Posted May 20, 2010 Share Posted May 20, 2010 I've only been doing Suby's about 3 years and the pretty blue bottles I've always received from the dealer did have "Holts" molded into the bottle. Must depend on area of the country or dealer stock. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StructEngineer Posted May 20, 2010 Share Posted May 20, 2010 My 2002 developed this oil seepage around 60,000. At first the Holts worked, but eventually it did nothing even with multiple doses. Once coolant started pissing out I had the HG's replaced at 98,000. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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