I've read about unbolting AC pump & "swinging" it out of the way to help making water pump replacement easier.  I'm thinking it would be even easier to remove the AC "radiator" that is in front of the coolant radiator (which I'd pull also) so I could work facing it straight on (my front grill is already removed), but I imagine I would have to crack open the lines and maybe not a big deal cause the AC at least needs a fresh charge( pretty low pressure when I press the "bleeder" valve under the black cap) ?  Maybe it's easy enough to do with just the extra space gained by pulling the coolant radiator?

 

I've got a bad water pump too and bought all the parts I need (I think?) to do the front gaskets & oil pump gasket - except the valve cover gaskets. Guess I should order them also (if it's easier to do at this time)?

Thanks Everybody

Craig

Timing belts are super easy, I dont remove anything for that easy job.

Complete kit -timing belts and pulleys. Two cam seals and two cam cap orings, crank seal, oil pump orings (2 of them); oil pump shaft seal, water pump, thermostat.  

How do you know for certain the water pump is bad, it’s leaking?

If it’s the original AC and working then it’s R22 refrigerant you can’t buy at the store.  Just leave it alone, or you’ll need to source R22 or covert to 134a. 

Valve covers are unrelated to that work but easy anyway.  Get new grommets too. 10mm ratcheting wrench is mandatory unless you like taking 13 minutes to get one bolt off on the lowers drivers side rear valve cover. Haha 

+1 on the ratcheting wrenches.

 

Well the AC isn't working right now anyways..

Starting last month I noticed the water leak - and put in 1/2 bottle of Barr's "pelletized" stop leak, and it stopped leaking for about 3 weeks - it may just be hoses going to/from the water pump, here's some details from last month - and a list of parts I've already bought
93 Loyale wagon 3ATwith 135k,000 miles - may need water pump & timing belt & front seals - Is it worth it?

Here's a link to a vid from underneath the car, when I loosen, then tighten the radiator cap. 

 

https://youtu.be/V4Y0xitJtwk

 

so I've added about 2~3 cups of water per day/trip and it hasn't overheated.  I imagine all the leaking water caused an idler to cease and then a belt snapped..

 

 

 

 

 

 

Pulling the engine radiator gives you some extra room to work.  No advantage pulling the AC radiator aka condenser.  

Flip the compressor up and back to get it out of the way.

Be sure to replace all 7 cooling system hoses.

Carefully inspect the radiator for condition.  All of the fine fins still connected to the tubes.

There is no oil pump gasket.   There are o rings.  And the shaft seal, if the orings are shot, you need that also.

Got the AC out of the way, removed power steering, alternator and radiator. Then took off outside fronts of plastic timing chain covers - driver side has snapped AND 90 degree elbow rubber hose (going to pipe  to heater) coming of water pump has a BIG SPLIT in it! I wouldn't be amazed if this isn't the original timing belts and the 90 degree elbow rubber hose. The broken timing belt has NO MARKINGS at all from what I can see of it so far, but the passenger belt looks like it may have 2  white alignment marks is that how the original belts are?

 

 

 

 

Original belts are marked Subaru.

I have never had a belt go more than 70k miles.  Usually,  expect a lot less.   I have been running ea82 engines since 1988.  The idler bearings are not good for much more.

If the hose clamps are the oem wire ones, that hose is probably original,  and that is way too long to go before replacing the 7 hoses. 

The wire type clamps don't look like they're spaced/installed like factory new ones and the hose itself looks off - the bend and curved lips at the end past the clamps looks different. maybe it's the split hose/overheating/age/photo - but given the age and those small details i'd guess the hose isn't original...and unlikely original belts too. 

Thank You for the quick support!  loosened flywheel nut using breaker bar & starter motor trick - quick flick on the ignition switch THUMP= done! I'm also digesting a Hayne's manual & they say when assembling to torque flywheel nut by taking off the starter motor- to get a screwdriver wedged in the flywheel teeth. I got a 3AT trannie & don't want to R & R the starter motor just to lock the flywheel AND it looks like a can easily get a wrench on a torque converter  bolt or jam an ear with a screwdriver) through the timing mark window on the top of the bell housing (to lock the crank,  while torquing flywheel nut ) - should that work?

 

thanks

 

 

 

 

 

 

maybe the water pump is also failing, if I spin the studs with my finger about half the time the end seal spins?

 

 

That is bad, the seal should not move.
I have always had good luck with the NAPA higher quality water pumps. 
 

I hold the flywheel with a 12MM box end wrench on one of the flex plate bolts while tightening the crank pulley bolt.   The most important thing is to keep it on place well, so it doesn't slip off and damage the bolt head.  They are lower profile than most 12MM bolts.

 

I've got a choice of TWO different pumps a can use - the one came from a member here, czny  and he says it is used and works fine but looks like new to me - it has the cast impeller and the only markings are " N13Z "  . I also bought a "brand new" one from Rockler that says "GMB Japan SU13 " with a stamped impeller. I can't easily decide which one use? Probably the new one ?

 

Edited October 25, 20187 yr by Craigar
image upload fighting with me ;)

Looks to me like either one will get the job done, I'm partial to any part that has 'Japan' on it since that's Fuji heavy industries' home turf, but that's probably just a logical fallacy.

Good luck! 

If it looks OEM that’s preferable. 

Theres is preference between stamped and cast impellers but ive never seen either fail so I’m uncertain why that sentiment exists. 

Get rid of the stamped one.

The cooling system is the most important thing to keep in top condition.   The stamped impeller cannot work as effectively as the cast one.  It is cheaper to make, that is all.

another "feature" I like of the cast impeller one is it has this "locking tab, I ASSUME?" pressed/punched in through this slot to prevent the shaft from moving horizontally? Also I would imagined the cast impeller should "macerate" most solid debris (including (if any) undissolved Barr's stop leak pellets I used) ?

 

 

Edited October 25, 20187 yr by Craigar
more details...

Flush the stop leak crud out thoroughly.  Don't use it again.

Thanks Dave ! I drained the radiator & block and saw nothing except the slightly milky water, it was pissin like a race horse towards the end (well at least a dachshund if stuck in slow traffic) , I think the rip in the elbow pipe may have became worse (I probably should have left my heater on) so I was "flushin is I go.." I'd go through a gallon of water in 3 or 4 days / 200 miles. . It seems "logical" to me I could "back flush" my radiator that pulled out right now by stickin a garden hose in the top pipe hole ? I even cleaned up the top of the motor so I can see easier what I'm doing (and also lessen the chance of appearing to be a slob in almost every area of my life!!)

 

Hey Dave, what ya think about my nicked up oil pump sprocket ? Thanks again!

https://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/topic/167990-ea82-timing-belt-replacement-discovered-nicked-up-oil-pump-pulley/

 

 

 

 

Edited October 26, 20187 yr by Craigar
also wanted dave's opinion on my nicked up oil pump pulley

If you are not at high altitude,  get a short piece of awg14 bare copper wire.  Make a c around the little check valve in the radiator  cap to hold it open.  This will allow you to run with a small leak, as long as you check and add water every drive.  Never allow air to collect in the upper radiator hose. 

Flushing the radiator and heater core is good.  Just don't allow more than 12 lbs of pressure to build.  Normal flow direction for the radiator is in at the top hose, across to the driver's side, out the bottom back to the engine. 

To flush the engine, remove the thermostat.   If you replace it, oem or the highest quality Stant only.

Unless I knew  the oil pump was recently new or resealed, I would remove it, reseal it.  Which involves removing the pulley to get at the shaft seal.  Then put a better pulley on it.

Thanks again DaveT. I probably wasn't clear about what I was trying to say  " WHEN I WAS DRIVING it was SOMETIMES pissin like a race horse (well really JUST a miniature dachshund if I WAS stuck in slow traffic) towards the end, before the T belt broke.  Never overheated. It seems "logical" to me I could "back flush" my radiator that IS pulled out OF THE CAR right now by stickin a garden hose in the top pipe hole and TURNING ON THE WATER FAUCET?  BUT now that I  understand the direction of flow in the radiator, to do a "back/reverse flush I would need to put the garden hose in the BOTTOM INLET/Pipe nipple? The only thing is the water isn't hot .. WHAT might be really slick is IF I FIRST flushed out my houses water heater (by a attach a garden hose to it's drain spigot and let it flush itself out), then afterwards let it heat up a tank of water and run that through the radiator via it's lower inlet...   Good thing is the radiator probably only has 20K miles on it.

 

1st back flush of radiator with garden hose, moderate flow from garden hose

2nd flush, using full flow from garden hose

no signs of "pellets" from Barr's stop leak - but some rusty looking little chunks. The water at full force had no noticable resistance going in, I just sealed it going in with my grip - seemed to come out of radiator as quick as going in

yes, run the water through backwards.  Hose to the lower fitting.  Hot wouldn't hurt, tends to loosen up stuff.  Just don't allow pressure to go above 12 or so PSI, so loose / leaky connection.   IF the radiator is not plugged, the flow capacity is a lot higher than the garden hose so no risk.

 

 

Sounds good, and looks like you got some junk out of there.

Definitely do the engine and heater core.

 

Pulled off good passenger timing belt and it's a Gates T300 U.S.A.  - but the snapped driver side belt has no markings at all - maybe they didn't EVER replace it - and if it was stock original I'd think it would have "Subaru" markings? All the old idler pulleys are fine and spin smooth, but going to replace anyways.

OK here's my setup for back flush starting at the the heater core, after I opened house water spigot all the way & ran back over to car, let kink out of hose and let water run through while holding hose nipple tight against heater core's return pipe - and exiting through the block via water pump opening .. probably would be "best" to seperate core from block & do both separately, but seems like so little junk overall that it's unnecessary for this around town commuter car.

Junk from first back flush of heater core via block drain hole..

Junk from SECOND back flush of heater core and block via block drain hole..

 

"Raisin" looking junk (probably orange/red hi temp silicone - pretty soft) from SECOND back flush of heater core and block via water pump opening..

backside of old water pump - more surface rust on impeller then when pulled yesterday, lots of humidity right now)

 

Edited October 27, 20187 yr by Craigar
more details...

wow, lots of crud in there.  Might be good to run it both ways.