Slagathor1 Posted October 10, 2005 Share Posted October 10, 2005 92 Loyale A/T 4WD. Yesterday I finished up the long task of removing the drivers side cam cage so I could pull the lifters & clean them (trying to get rid of the "tick of death"). Well everything is back together & the tick is almost unoticable now BUT the car is running like an old tractor & puffing erradicaly through the exhaust. It's not backfiring & it will idle without having to give it very much extra gas but it's running like 1 or 2 cylinders aren't firing correctly. Today I pulled the spark plugs & they tested fine & so did the plug wires. I set the timing again by turning the flywheel timing marks to zero & making sure the disty rotor was pointing to the #1 cylinder contact. It still ran the same. I even turned the rotor 180 degrees to make sure I wasn't firing on the exhaust stroke. Nope that's not it either. The plug wires are definately on the disty in the correct firing order also. Whats so weird about all this is the car ran fine before the tear down. Is it possible that when I replaced my timing belts, I set the cam timing off a little?? When I timed the cams I put the passenger side mark straight up, then rotated the engine 180 degrees & installed the drivers side with the mark straight up. Afterwards the marks were at 12 & 6 like they should be. BUT I suppose there is the possibility that they weren't exactly at 6 & 12 & may be a tooth or 2 or 3 off. Would that cause this erradic behavior?? Any other ideas?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
torxxx Posted October 10, 2005 Share Posted October 10, 2005 I think you are a tooth off on your timing belts. its not a matter of 12 oclock an 6 oclock on the belts. There are notches made in the rear t-belt covers where the hole on the cam will line up with a groove int he black plastic directly about it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slagathor1 Posted October 10, 2005 Author Share Posted October 10, 2005 I'm sure I had them lined up with the marks but I agree I must've missed them by a little bit. I've done timing belts twice before & always hit the timing right on the nose. So just being even 1 tooth off can affect the operation this much??? I've always kind of wondered about that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snowman Posted October 10, 2005 Share Posted October 10, 2005 Yeah, having it off one tooth will make it run like absolute crap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hondasucks Posted October 11, 2005 Share Posted October 11, 2005 did you line the flywheel up with the 0 mark, or with the center of the three lines? If you had it lined up to the 0 timing mark, that is your problem. Roll the engine over until the pointer lines up with the center of the three lines in the flywheel, and then look @ the cam sprockets. One should be at 12:00 and the other at 6:00, both lined up with either the upper or lower notch in the timing belt cover. Doesn't matter which one is up and which is down, as long as they are not both facing the same direction, since it is the camshaft that dictates what stroke the piston is on.. Also, you might need to re-do the dizzy timing once you re-set the camshaft if that is what is off, since then the dizzy might be off. Re check the cam timing and try and run it, if it runs better then check the ignition timing with a timing light and adjust accordingly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
draggon Posted October 11, 2005 Share Posted October 11, 2005 did you line the flywheel up with the 0 mark, or with the center of the three lines? thats what i was going to ask,seeing how i did it not to long ago,it was the 1st thing i thought of. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slagathor1 Posted October 11, 2005 Author Share Posted October 11, 2005 I lined the 3 marks up when I timed the cams. I lined the 0 degree mark when I timed the disty. So everything is fine there. I think all the symptoms are still pointing to the fact that I probably just missed the cam timing by a tooth or two. I was kind of rushing to get it back together this time. After I got the timing belts back on I didn't bother rotating the engine several times to make sure the belts settled in where they were supposed to be. I usually do that for good measure but not this time. OOOPS. Guess i'll find out tommorrow whats wrong, i'm gonna rip it all open 1 more time & see what I can find. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snowman Posted October 11, 2005 Share Posted October 11, 2005 Did you spin the engine 180 degrees between timing one camshaft and the other? Just checking to make sure that it's not something simple like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slagathor1 Posted October 11, 2005 Author Share Posted October 11, 2005 Yep, I definately spun it 180 degrees without a doubt. I'll bet I just moved the cam a little while installing the belts. I'll find out tommorrow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slagathor1 Posted October 12, 2005 Author Share Posted October 12, 2005 HEY GUESS WHAT!!! The cam timing marks were perfectly centered on 6 & 12 with the pointer on the middle of the three marks on the flywheel. I checked & rotated, checked & rotated,etc. They're perfect down to the tooth!! OK now i'm officially thoroughly confused!! I buttoned everything back up, checked my firing order, confirmed the rotor position in the disty at #1 cylinder with the 0 degree mark on the flywheel, made sure it was on the firing stroke, checked my plugs for fire, plug wires for fire, checked the firing order 5 more times with the suby manual, rotated the disty back & forth with engine running. Everything is perfect!! WHAT GIVES?? While the engine was running, I even pulled one plug wire off at a time to see if there was any change in the running. AHAAAAAAA!!! The passenger side bank was running fine. When I got to the drivers side (the side I originally had torn apart down to the lash adjusters) I found that the whole bank is dead even though the plugs were firing strong. I even switched the drivers side plug wires in case they were backwards. Whoops, nope thats not it, now the engine REALLY hates me judging by what it told me out of the exhaust pipe!! Basically the engine is running on two cylinders. Once again I just don't get it. What else could possibly have gone wrong. I did have the lash adjusters out & cleaned them very good inside & out. Could it be they're not pumping up & the cam isn't even opening the valves now?? That sounds kinda far out but who knows. Any suggestions??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
555Ron Posted October 12, 2005 Share Posted October 12, 2005 Do a compression check. You must have stuffed the installation of the rockers or something, maybe you will have to tear it down again?? Thats really strange... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pink Floyd Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 Hello... Maybe, the oil pressure for these side of the engine is low. It can reduce the valve lifters work. Sometimes changing the gaskets, silicon or glue clug the oil pressure holes.. First, check the pressure of the cilinders... Good Luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
82bratavenger Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 Did you clean the lifters in oil fully subbmerged. If you completely cleaned all the oil out of them, they have to be re-charged of pumped up (fully subbmerged) before you re-install them. Also the oil hole in them needs to be lined up correctly so the engine can maintain the oil pressure in the lifters. I learned this the hard way and had the same type of problems you are having. I had to take it apart again to fix it. A compression check is good also but if your valves are not opening and closing right the compression could be fine but the timing would still be off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Romero Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 Man I've got the same symptoms, but my tune-up wasn't as extensive as yours. I just replaced the ignition components: 1) rotor 2) disty cap 3) wires 4) plugs I gapped all the plugs right, and made double sure that the firing order was correct on the plugs and disty terminals. Now the thing is running like a sick lawnmower, with a huge flat spot, and lots of noise???? This has to be something with the ignition or vacuum I'm thinking. I hope I didn't fry something inside the distributor. ./steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woot4roos Posted February 3, 2006 Share Posted February 3, 2006 may sound like a tard here...... but have ya checked the cap for undo moisture. could have installed the intake gasket wrong.... but sounds like youve done this before. best o luck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tizzle Posted February 4, 2006 Share Posted February 4, 2006 OK, can I compare this to my problem? I changed the drivers side head. Car Idles beautifully, but when I try to get on the gas, the power is just not there. I REALLY don't want to take that cam case off again, just thinking about it...ugh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbone Posted February 4, 2006 Share Posted February 4, 2006 Man I've got the same symptoms, but my tune-up wasn't as extensive as yours. I just replaced the ignition components: 1) rotor 2) disty cap 3) wires 4) plugs I gapped all the plugs right, and made double sure that the firing order was correct on the plugs and disty terminals. Now the thing is running like a sick lawnmower, with a huge flat spot, and lots of noise???? This has to be something with the ignition or vacuum I'm thinking. I hope I didn't fry something inside the distributor. ./steve Check your firing order, again. Quote.... tizzle OK, can I compare this to my problem? I changed the drivers side head. Car Idles beautifully, but when I try to get on the gas, the power is just not there. I REALLY don't want to take that cam case off again, just thinking about it...ugh Check your timing, again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted February 4, 2006 Share Posted February 4, 2006 Something I've noticed about the EA82's... a vacuum leak will give a similar result at idle for whichever bank it's closer to. Try pulling the plug wires at 2k RPM and see if you hear a change. No change at idle could just be a forgotton vac line. Something I've run into before. And yes - compression check is the FIRST order of business after doing the above.... GD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baccaruda Posted February 9, 2006 Share Posted February 9, 2006 I'm dealing with a similar problem on a friend's car. Her car broke a timing belt (the driver's side, of course) and the belt stuffed the oil pump, or it was already stuffed. So I put on a good junkyard oil pump with new seals and changed the timing belts and tensioners. I have the timing belts on "exactly correct" according to 6oclock/12oclock and according to the marks in the plastic covers. It runs like crap. I have yet to pull the plug wires (good idea) to see what happens, and plan to hook up my timing light tomorrow just to see what it says, but what is confusing/frustrating is that the belts are visually correct. I have redone the belts once, according to the USMB and/or HTKYSA writeup, to all of the same results. Looks perfect, runs like crap. ?????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hooziewhatsit Posted February 9, 2006 Share Posted February 9, 2006 you guys did put the drivers side belt on first with the cam up, right? Just because the cams are 180* out doesn't mean the disty is firing on the right turn... only thing I can think of (the disty should be pointing to the #1 plug when the passenger cam is pointing North-West) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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