PA inspection is stupid

[LosDiosDeVerde86]

Straight from the horse's mouth...

http://www.dmv.state.pa.us/pdotforms/pub_45/section_e.pdf

 

Other related legalese and gobblydeegook can be found at:

http://www.dmv.state.pa.us/inspections/pub_45.shtml

 

FAQ and a couple other links:

http://www.dmv.state.pa.us/inspections/safety.shtml

 

good work.

[the_bard]

Wasn't much... I knew NY had the reg's posted, so I thought PA might have 'em too. A quick Google search later...

[pearlm30]

My 96 outback failed the inspection this morning because of the crack in the windshield. Its not in driver direct viewing area, its across from the top left. I will try to post a pic. Any advice? They told me I need to replace within 10 days of the registration. What happen if I cant?

Never had problems in FL since no inspection is required.

Thanks

[94Loyale]

Post a picture of it if you can. Basically, if it's within the range of the driver's side windshield wiper, it's a fail. Or if the crack is hazardous at any other point on the windshield. I am a certified PA inspection mechanic. If I remember right for little stuff, the area you go by is, with the driver sitting in the driver's seat, the area is about 8.5 wide by 6 in tall, from your direct line of sight.

[pearlm30]

I took couple of pictures, the crack is within the wiper range.

Please advice.

Thanks

[nipper]

That crack is HUGE. I am sorry but that is a hard failure and anyone who thinks that is NOT within the drivers line of site is blind.

 

Any crack that big anywhere in the windshield is a failure and unsafe. The windshield works with the airbags to hepl protect passengers in a crash. A HUGE crack like that compromise the strength of the windshield.

 

In some cars the windshield is a structural part of the car too.

 

That is not a small crack or an unreasonable failure in any stretch of the imagination. That is also a violation where you could get a ticket for failed equipment.

 

In ten days your temp inspection sticker expires and it would be the same as driving around with an uninspected car.

 

nipper

[Gloyale]

 

Any crack that big anywhere in the windshield is a failure and unsafe. The windshield works with the airbags to hepl protect passengers in a crash. A HUGE crack like that compromise the strength of the windshield.

 

 

 

This is the standard line of BS they always spew.

 

HELLO!!!! the windshield is double layer laminated over a sheet of high strentgh plastic. In any serious accident the glass shatters immediately, and the plastic is what keeps people in and glass from impalling people. The crack isn't going to make that plastic any less safe.

 

The ONLY thing unsafe about that is the view obstruction, which if you are short really isn't in the view. I don't know how tall the driver is.

 

But we don't make the laws, it's a bum deal.....but your gonna have to fix it though.

 

Soooooo Glad Oregon dosen't have inspections. They are just money maker regulations to force you to spend more on a vehicle, or buy a new one (gee, why would a steel producing state want to force people to buy more cars?)

[nipper]

This is the standard line of BS they always spew.

 

HELLO!!!! the windshield is double layer laminated over a sheet of high strentgh plastic. In any serious accident the glass shatters immediately, and the plastic is what keeps people in and glass from impalling people. The crack isn't going to make that plastic any less safe.

 

The ONLY thing unsafe about that is the view obstruction, which if you are short really isn't in the view. I don't know how tall the driver is.

 

But we don't make the laws, it's a bum deal.....but your gonna have to fix it though.

 

Soooooo Glad Oregon dosen't have inspections. They are just money maker regulations to force you to spend more on a vehicle, or buy a new one (gee, why would a steel producing state want to force people to buy more cars?)

 

 

I stongly disagree on all levels. A car with a rusted out subframe is dangerous, as well as bad front end parts and bad brakes. Most drivers do not notice these issues and drive the cars till things brake. Having been hit by someone who lost thier brakes in a non inspection state, I can personally attest that they are needed.

 

And look at his crack, it is huge and dangerous. Yes it IS a double laminate, but that crack compromises the strength of the glass. It is really dnagerous to say a year of saftey is not worth the 40 bucks. The excuse of that they catch it when the car is in the shop for maintanence doesnt work either as many people use an oil change place that does not inspect the front end or brakes. Also quite a few people who do thier own oil changes never bother to inspect those parts.

 

Now with cars that can go a year without an oil change, it is much more important to have inspections.

[94Loyale]

I agree completely with Nipper. Sure, inspections seem like a pain in the rump roast to us, because we know our cars, and most of us regulars work on them all the time. But the other 80% of the population doesn't know a damn thing. Regular inspections keep everyone safe. Lots of people say "it's just the state trying to get money", I can't tell you how many times I've heard that. A state inspection sticker only costs $2....that's it. The rest of the money you pay goes to the inspection garage. I've failed a lot of vehicles in terrible shape by owners who just don't have a clue, wheel bearings falling apart, cords showing on tires, parts falling off. And just to think that if we didn't have a regular inspection, these cars would be on the road driving. Being someone's potential murderer. That includes the driver, their passengers, or you minding your own business in the other lane. Most of the public just drives their vehicles, doesn't pay attention to the noises they make, or the way the car feels, they just keep driving. Honestly, inspection is not very hard to pass through. Except emissions...emissions testing is bs in my opinion.

 

As far as that windshield goes, I could care less for theories on whether it's dangerous or not. A- It's a huge crack B- It's well within your sight (you guys honestly don't just sit there and stare straight ahead when you drive right?) C- It's a failure, sorry

 

 

Edit- I surely didn't mean to be ignorant to anyone with this response. But when you see these type of things everyday. It starts to bother you when people tell you that inspection is not necessary. I just didn't want anyone to be offended.

Edited December 8, 2010 by 94Loyale

[davebugs]

In PA (like a lot of states) it's mostly about the money.

 

At one time we had inspections every 6 months. Then they actually went to a year and everyone wondered why the gov't would give up that money.

 

Turns out they knew the emissions gravy train was coming!

 

Force inspection stations to buy certain machines from "approved" sources (read kick backs). Still sell 2 stickers per year (now one inspection and one emission), keep getting the federal tax money (that WE paid in) coming back to us by jumping through the fed's hoops.

 

The emissions machines, training & certification, care, feeding, calibration are very good for the state.

 

 

I don't care much about the windshield as long as it's not in the line of view.

 

The unseen stuff, especially for folks that just get in and drive do concern me. Things like brake LINES, even more than pads. Gas lines, Unibody rust, Suspension parts (bushings, ball joints, tie rod ends) stuff like that. Lights - easy to check but I worry more about structural stuff.

 

If you're in a non emissions area the car can run so poorly it can't get out of it's own way but it'll pass. If the lights work, brake lining is good, etc. Thing can run like crap.

 

If you're in an emissions area it can still run like crap, but if it passes emissions yoiu're golden. You may get run over getting onto an interstate - but the car will have a fresh inspection sticker!

[pearlm30]

Thanks for all the advice and suggestions. I will get it replaced as soon as I can. My other concern is that the sealant/urethane around the windshield that installers use, I have seen the whole windshield poped out of the car during crash on youtube video, plus installer almost always use Chinese cheap windshield. My windshield is still original/OEM and never been replaced before. Also the weather/temp. hovering from 15 to 25F, how long am I suppose to wait before the sealant/urethane cured?

[davebugs]

Real glass shops do still exist.

 

Insurance will try and push to you to a chain of guys in vans. They get real good prices, and you get a crappy windshield. Safelite did my last one - twice. WIndshield is crap and just cracked. Advance auto paid - twice, and almost a 3rd time for a genuine OEM VW one. Lets just say that I've made it up in parts.

 

 

I'd look for a "real" glass shop. Take it there, they'll take it indoors and in heat, and do it.

[Gloyale]

And look at his crack, it is huge and dangerous. Yes it IS a double laminate, but that crack compromises the strength of the glass. It is really dnagerous to say a year of saftey is not worth the 40 bucks.

 

The sticker is $40.

 

Fixing the windshield is $200+

 

The only reason cars fall apart so bad in inspection states in the first place is the salt and the rust. Which is also caused by state government.

 

A cracked windshield being "dangerous" is BS. Salted roads are intentional sabotage. They just want to make people pump money into the economy.

[Fairtax4me]

I see cars with windshields that look like spider webs and wonder how the hell the driver can see through the cracks to drive. That would drive me nuts!

One crack is whatever, but the whole reason they make people replace cracked windshields to pass safety inspection is because of the ones who would drive with a straight up broken one if it didn't fail. Catch the glare of the sun in a broken windshield and you can understand why it's not safe. One crack isn't going to blind you, but if that one crack multiplies to 6 or 8 or 10 cracks going in all directions.

 

If you wan't a good windshield, ask the installer to order the brand that the factory installs. Windshields have a label in the corner with the maker and all the certifications. Or you can order one from a dealer. $$$

[StructEngineer]

A cracked windshield being "dangerous" is BS. Salted roads are intentional sabotage. They just want to make people pump money into the economy.

 

I guarantee you the DOT's are not sophisticated enough to coordinate an economic stimulus plan.

[nipper]

In PA (like a lot of states) it's mostly about the money.

 

At one time we had inspections every 6 months. Then they actually went to a year and everyone wondered why the gov't would give up that money.

 

Turns out they knew the emissions gravy train was coming!

 

Force inspection stations to buy certain machines from "approved" sources (read kick backs). Still sell 2 stickers per year (now one inspection and one emission), keep getting the federal tax money (that WE paid in) coming back to us by jumping through the fed's hoops.

 

The emissions machines, training & certification, care, feeding, calibration are very good for the state.

 

 

I don't care much about the windshield as long as it's not in the line of view.

 

The unseen stuff, especially for folks that just get in and drive do concern me. Things like brake LINES, even more than pads. Gas lines, Unibody rust, Suspension parts (bushings, ball joints, tie rod ends) stuff like that. Lights - easy to check but I worry more about structural stuff.

 

If you're in a non emissions area the car can run so poorly it can't get out of it's own way but it'll pass. If the lights work, brake lining is good, etc. Thing can run like crap.

 

If you're in an emissions area it can still run like crap, but if it passes emissions yoiu're golden. You may get run over getting onto an interstate - but the car will have a fresh inspection sticker!

 

You just killed your own argument. His windsheild (which is what we are talking about here) is in his line of view, and it is HUGE.

 

State doesnt calibrate feed or pay for certifiaction, that is on the back of the garage that does the inspection (unless it is a state inspector) and still someone pays for that. Being an inspector, sorry, car runs like crap it does not pass. Pre OBDII some people cheat, but if any car came in running like crap to me I would fail it as it is my rump roast on the line (When I did inspect). I never knew when it is a spot check from DMV.

Edited December 9, 2010 by nipper

[johnceggleston]

i don't have a problem with state inspections. if it is bad enough to fail it needs to be replaced / repaired.

 

i do have a problem with shops who tell me it will cost 450$ to fix what the car needs to pass only to learn when i go in and look at everything that the service writer''mis-spoke'' and he mis-understood the technician who actually did look at the car.

it only needed front pads.

 

that's just wrong, and it happens every day.

 

it does seem unfair to have to buy a new windshield for a 90 nissan pickup when i only drive 1500 miles a year. but if i want to drive it on the open road in VA that is what i will take.

 

the last time i needed a windshield i shopped and got it installed for ~100$.

[94Loyale]

Nipper, absolutely correct. If the car runs terrible it fails in my book. It's up to our discretion whether the car is safe enough to pass inspection. Inspection is not just the things outlined in the handbook. If there is something (poor running), that the inspector feels is unsafe about the vehicle, we have the right to fail it. Anyone that passes a car that can't get out of it's own way is not a good inspection mechanic.

[StructEngineer]

it does seem unfair to have to buy a new windshield for a 90 nissan pickup when i only drive 1500 miles a year.

 

Unfair? I would be pissed whether or not you (in your 90 nissan pickup or a new Lexus) hit me because you couldn't properly see out of your windshield.