Juan Posted October 25, 2007 Share Posted October 25, 2007 OK. I'm going to get the 30k service done at dealer so that any/all problems are properly documented while still under warranty 36k warranty. Do I need more service than schduled in MY 2005 warranty booklet? Driving in Portland, Oregon area. Not really severe driving conditions. Dealer calling for, but not mentioned in maintenance schedule: Fuel injector cleaning $75. Auto tranny screen replacement $80. (manual says never needs it) Front/rear differntial fluid replacement $68. I just want to do: plugs at $90 (by the way, 2.5 engine adds $52) Brake fluid $35 Coolant $50 Full inspection $23 Brake/exhaust/suspension/steering system just in case there is a problem while it's still under warranty. Just changed the oil and popped a new air filter in it. Do I need anything more? Juan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted October 25, 2007 Share Posted October 25, 2007 keep in mind the "service" department is very much geared towards "sales", they are trained, encouraged and evaluated on sales and generated sales. i'm not saying these services are bad, but certainly not necessary either. Fuel injector cleaning $75. you definitely do not need that. tell them no. add your own fuel injector cleaner if you like. there is really no need for ever having this service done. you should add your own fuel injector cleaner as you see fit. if you like to be on top of maintenance and your injectors, then send them off to be professionally cleaned/rebuilt around 150k, it only costs $75 - $200 for a set of four. Auto tranny screen replacement $80. (manual says never needs it)tell them no as well. if this is the internal screen they are talking about, then it's not even a filter, yours won't even be dirty. i've removed them with 150,000 miles on them and even then i've never seen one that needed replaced. it is not a filter and does not need replacement. it's a strainer and anything it prevents getting sucked up should come out with a fluid change. so yeah - tell them no on that too. BUT - i your transmission fluid and filter (if it has an external filter, which i think 4EAT's got after 1998), those should be changed at regular intervals - manual probably says 30k or 60k. Front/rear differntial fluid replacement $68. that's not a terrible idea, but i'd personally wait until 60,000 miles for those. what does the manual call for? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juan Posted October 25, 2007 Author Share Posted October 25, 2007 Thanks for the reply, Grossgarry. I'm heading for some injector cleaner ASAP. Any brand preferance? The manual says, "The ATF filter is a maintenance free part. The ATF filter needs replacement only when it has physical damage or if the ATF has leaked." The manual never calls for replacement of ATF/differential fluid or gear oil; only inspection at 30k intervals. I'll have them inspect all and change it all out at 60k. Should I shell out an extra $44 for platinum plugs or just keep replacing them OEM every 30k? Jess Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted October 25, 2007 Share Posted October 25, 2007 Thanks for the reply, Grossgarry. I'm heading for some injector cleaner ASAP. Any brand preferance? every has their own oppininion - im' an MMO user (marvel mystery oil). The manual says, "The ATF filter is a maintenance free part. The ATF filter needs replacement only when it has physical damage or if the ATF has leaked." keep in mind that post 1998 4EAT's got an external filter, i would assume that's on all 4EAT's since but am not sure. anyway, there is the possibility that your transmission has 2 "filters". the one they have always had, the internal screen that really isn't a filter. and the newer addition of a second filter that would be a screw on style similar to your engine oil filter. if their talking about the screen filter, i'd never replace that. if it has the external transmission fluid filter i would replace that every 60k no matter what the manual says about it. i certainly wouldn't leave it on there for the life of the vehicle. The manual never calls for replacement of ATF/differential fluid or gear oil; only inspection at 30k intervals. I'll have them inspect all and change it all out at 60k. the diff oils likely won't need replacing then, but it's not a bad idea either. definitely have them checked at least, make sure you're not loosing any. Should I shell out an extra $44 for platinum plugs or just keep replacing them OEM every 30k? i'd stick with OEM on this motor. though OEM is only an NGK plug that's avaiable for a buck or two at the parts store instead of $8 each at Subaru. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
porcupine73 Posted October 25, 2007 Share Posted October 25, 2007 Yes many of the items call for inspection only, but if you look at the 'footnotes', there are exceptions for various items for 'severe duty' including towing, cold weather operation, dusty conditions, short trips, etc. You can view the sched. at http://www.subaru.com and click 'owners' from the top menu. For fuel injector cleaners I like Lucas UCL with some RedLine SI~1 mix. I add a little bit at EVERY fillup. The detergent pack of even 'top tier' fuels is lacking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted October 25, 2007 Share Posted October 25, 2007 Fuel injector cleaner is BUNK. For the most part fuel is a solvent and injectors don't need to be cleaned. Eventually they need to be rebuilt, but cleaning rarely helps an injector that needs rebuilding. You DO NOT need to clean your injectors at 30k miles. That's just sillyness. GD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WAWalker Posted October 26, 2007 Share Posted October 26, 2007 Subaru does say that the spin on transmission filters do not need to be replaced. But it is not a bad idea. The OEM filter is a little spendy compaired to an oil filter. Fuel injector cleaning is not nessasary IMO. But at higher milage I think it is a good idea. Not that the fuel injectors themself need to be cleaned, but more due to the fact that it is cleaning carbon from the intake ports, valves, and pistons. Carbon build up will absorbe fuel, leaning out the fuel air mixture. I short it will affect efficency of your engine. I always recommend replacing differentail and MT fluids every 30k. I have drained some 30k mile diffs that had nasty looking fluid in them. Also depending on how a car is used the front diff fluid on automatics is, I believe, affected more by heat than is the rear diff, due to exhaust and transmission heat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted October 26, 2007 Share Posted October 26, 2007 OK. I'm going to get the 30k service done at dealer so that any/all problems are properly documented while still under warranty 36k warranty. Do I need more service than schduled in MY 2005 warranty booklet? Driving in Portland, Oregon area. Not really severe driving conditions. Dealer calling for, but not mentioned in maintenance schedule: Fuel injector cleaning $75. Auto tranny screen replacement $80. (manual says never needs it) Front/rear differntial fluid replacement $68. I just want to do: plugs at $90 (by the way, 2.5 engine adds $52) Brake fluid $35 Coolant $50 Full inspection $23 Brake/exhaust/suspension/steering system just in case there is a problem while it's still under warranty. Just changed the oil and popped a new air filter in it. Do I need anything more? Juan. You dont need any of that. All you need is an oil change (which you did). Plugs and wires are good for 100,000 miles. Fuel injector cleaning, as far as im concerned never, or untill you have a problem. Tranny fluid flush ONLY. DO NOT DROP THE PAN. You dont need the screen (ever), and more pans leak when they are reinstalled. Differential fluid you can have done. Coolant flush you can do. Ful inspection, trust me, if something was wrong with the car they would have said so. Don't go to this dealer anymore, he's trying to nickle and dime you to death. Every time the car goes on a lift it gets inspected. Its not like hes going to let you leave with bad brakes. nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WAWalker Posted October 26, 2007 Share Posted October 26, 2007 If there is somthing wrong that the dealer would have to fix under warranty............they may not tell you till the car is out of warranty. If you don't trust your local stealership, find a good indepenent who knows Subarus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted October 26, 2007 Share Posted October 26, 2007 unfortunately this is common practice and he may have a hard time finding a good dealer. buying lots of subaru's and working on them for friends/family i see tons of paper work with bogus charges like this, thousands of dollars worth in some cases. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vic/se Posted October 26, 2007 Share Posted October 26, 2007 I agree with grossgary. My dealer was very conscious so i did pay very little for the 30 000mi insp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jib Posted November 1, 2007 Share Posted November 1, 2007 Fuel injector cleaner is BUNK. For the most part fuel is a solvent and injectors don't need to be cleaned. Eventually they need to be rebuilt, but cleaning rarely helps an injector that needs rebuilding. You DO NOT need to clean your injectors at 30k miles. That's just sillyness. GD GD, Please tell me how injectors are rebuilt, bacause you really don't understand the process? Injectors are non-serviceable. If you send them off to be rebuilt, they clean and paint them and replace the O-rings. That's the rebuild. These guys, regarless of the name, are very well respected in the industry. Check out what they say. http://www.witchhunter.com/ My 02 Leg GT was popping CL's for an O2 sensor and had soot in the tail pipe. Some agressive injector cleaner usage solved the issue. Jack Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ericem Posted November 1, 2007 Share Posted November 1, 2007 Can't anyone clean the injectors in some acohol? How do I remove them to begin with? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted November 1, 2007 Share Posted November 1, 2007 GD, Please tell me how injectors are rebuilt, bacause you really don't understand the process? Injectors are non-serviceable. If you send them off to be rebuilt, they clean and paint them and replace the O-rings. That's the rebuild. These guys, regarless of the name, are very well respected in the industry. Check out what they say. http://www.witchhunter.com/ My 02 Leg GT was popping CL's for an O2 sensor and had soot in the tail pipe. Some agressive injector cleaner usage solved the issue. Jack Well you had an issue. You dont do an injector cleaning just for the heck of it. Some injectors are rebuildable, some arent worth the labor to rebuild them http://www.fuelinjectioncorp.com/products/injectors.php If the coil inst replaced, then having a FI rebuilt is useless. nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted November 1, 2007 Share Posted November 1, 2007 Please tell me how injectors are rebuilt, bacause you really don't understand the process? It's entirely possible that I understand more than you think Jack. It's also entirely possible that I have rebuilt injectors and bench tested them. I was a diesel mechanic in the Army. There are mechanical injectors, and there are electro-mechanical injectors. Both have moving parts that wear, and both will develop leakage and spray pattern problems from said wear. GD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted November 1, 2007 Share Posted November 1, 2007 Diesels are a differnt animal GD, but yes those are 100% rebuildable. I have rebuilt them too, just talking gasoline didnt think it was relevant. nipper Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rooster2 Posted November 1, 2007 Share Posted November 1, 2007 It is difficult finding a good dealer no mater what brand of car/truck you own. I talked with a lady at the gas pumps while filling up today. Complemented her on her Yukon truck. It was a 2003 model. I asked her how good a truck has it been. She said good, except for the recent leak in the truck's plastic gas tank. The dealer charged her $1200 to replace the gas tank. My jaw about hit the ground upon hearing that. Stealer ships are everywhere, beware!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jib Posted November 5, 2007 Share Posted November 5, 2007 I stand corrected. Prior to now, I've never seen or heard of a electrically actived, gasoline injector that could be disassembled and rebuilt beyond the pintle cap and O-rings. Sorry! Jack Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jib Posted November 6, 2007 Share Posted November 6, 2007 Double post Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jib Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 Can't anyone clean the injectors in some acohol? How do I remove them to begin with? Eric, I cleaned up a set that had sat for 7 years and would not flow much at all (they dribbled) by removing them and flowing turpentine through them with compressed air as a driving force and a 12V, 1amp power supply, switched on and off using me, tapping the wire on the power supply clamp as the switch. I had four injectors wired in series, as they were low inpedance injectors and I didn't want to damage them. When all eight injectors would spray the same pattern on the ceiling (30 psi Lucas injectors), I was done. The car runs fine now. This process involves nasty chemicals and the potential to overcurrent the injectors, destroying them. Do not attempt it unless you know what you are doing. It is not hard to damage injectors. They have small solenoid built into them. Too much current will fry these coils, rendering the injector useless and new ones are expensive. The Pintles are precision machined parts and a nick or ding can damage them. Soaking in alcohol or solvent will likelyl not clean them effectively. They need to be flowed with a cleaner. For most of us, adding a good injector cleaner (Chevron Techron, Redline S1, etc.) on a few successive tanks of gas will do the trick. One method of on car cleaning that has worked for me is to add enough injector cleaner to treat a full tank of fuel when it was at 1/4 tank and run this mix until the low fuel light came on, preferrable quickly (days, not weeks), as it's a high level of solvent in your fuel system. Add another full tank treatment at the gas station before you fill up and the system should be pretty clean by the end of that tank full. If this does not do it, yank then out and send them off to a cleaning (rebuilding) service; www.witchhunter.com is well reagarded, but there are many others. They will clean them, replace a few seals, etc and flow test them. Usually, they can restore them to OEM specs for under $20/injector. This will be the same or close to an on-car cleaning, but will be far more effective and you will know if it was successful or not. These services claim to "restore" injectors, but basically, it's a heavy duty cleaning, flow check and replacement of consumable parts. At 30K, simply adding a good injector cleaner to a full tank of gas is the most you should need to do. Jack Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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