Txakura Posted February 4, 2010 Share Posted February 4, 2010 I stopped by the local machine shop today to see what their shop rate for resurfacing my (ea82) flywheel would be. Good guys, small shop. Re-surfacing is no prob, $42 or some such... anyway... I am getting ready for an (eventual but pretty damn soon) ej 22. I like the idea of using a lighter flywheel for faster throttle response, but don't want to lose too much torque. I will use my 4wd, but I am not likely to get as far out as some of the really dedicated guys here. I'm more in the gravel, on logging roads, in the snow etc etc but not breaking a new trail. Not the really gnarly rocker panel bashing stuff (which I wholeheartedly endorse and approve of). :cool: ok, so long build up, but I figured the obvious first reply was 'well what are you going to use it for'? some 4wd, mainly gravel What do you guys think is a middle ground on flywheel machining? Losing 5% or 10% mass for quicker throttle response versus losing too much mass and the torque going out the window with it. Lots of great minds here, this should be interesting Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted February 4, 2010 Share Posted February 4, 2010 You won't lose any appreciable amount of torque. And remember - when it's in gear you have the weight of the pressure plate and the disc to help. The EJ flywheels are much thinner/lighter. Go nuts - just don't go so thin that it causes temp/warping issues. "starting torque" or the tendancy for the flywheel to assist with clutch engagement is an issue with larger, heavier vehicles and equipment. Mostly deisel stuff that's low geared to begin with. The flyhweel is so massive that the engagement of the clutch doesn't really slow it down much. With a Subaru this is not that big of a deal. Mostly they have big gnarly flywheel's on these things to help them run smooth with the 3-main crank. You might get some noticeable drop in idle quality, but that's about it. GD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Txakura Posted February 4, 2010 Author Share Posted February 4, 2010 ah... so this is where a well balanced engine definitely comes into play also. This begs follow ups, this side of warping, what's nuts? what appreciable difference will this actually make? has anyone else done this? surely someone must have tried it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted February 4, 2010 Share Posted February 4, 2010 Just don't go any thinner than the EJ stuff. It might be better to take some material off, and also drill some holes to lighten it. I know Skip lightened a few - mostly for EA82T's I beleive. You might see if you can get ahold of him - though he might be in winter hibernation or something GD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moosens Posted February 4, 2010 Share Posted February 4, 2010 Not bashing Skip but I recently saw my barely used lightened flywheel - by Skip -and its not what I would call wonderful. For one thing the correct way to machine this object is NOT on a lathe -believe it or not. It should be done on a milling machine. My lightened XT flywheel has some bluing spots and if it wasn't for just wanting to wrap up this project I'd have gone for another flywheel. Skip do what he could. But to the guy who worked on my car - and for my eyes - it just didn't work out so well. Good luck with yours. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quidam Posted February 4, 2010 Share Posted February 4, 2010 Flywheel spec for XT6 is .815, for an EA-82 .827. But it's the same clutch kit. From the disc surface to the pressure plate mounting surface. What do you think of that? Doug I got those specs from RHINO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twilightprotege Posted February 4, 2010 Share Posted February 4, 2010 what is it with people and lightened flywheels thinking they'll loose torque? all you are loosing is momentum, which isnt a bad thing. you GAIN torque at the wheels (where it matters) when you lighten the flywheel as less of the engine's power goes into turning the flywheel around and allows it to go to the wheels where you want it. the engine will make no more or less power and thus torque no matter what you do after the engine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vagen Posted February 4, 2010 Share Posted February 4, 2010 a lightened flywheel will not affect the power output of an engine in anyway. It does however affect the power delivery due to some loss being removed. As a result the car will be quicker and that makes it all worth while. My car May or may not have a lightened flywheel the debate rages on that, we'll find out when the new clutch goes in. I've had light flywheels in all my race cars they make up and down shifting much faster and rev matching is almost instantaneous. If you have a flywheel lightened make sure it is rebalanced when they are through. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostinthe202 Posted February 4, 2010 Share Posted February 4, 2010 Not bashing Skip but I recently saw my barely used lightened flywheel - by Skip -and its not what I would call wonderful. For one thing the correct way to machine this object is NOT on a lathe -believe it or not. It should be done on a milling machine. My lightened XT flywheel has some bluing spots and if it wasn't for just wanting to wrap up this project I'd have gone for another flywheel. Skip do what he could. But to the guy who worked on my car - and for my eyes - it just didn't work out so well. Good luck with yours. Why is that? The resurfaced ones I've seen pics of look like they were ground which makes more sense to me then doing the work on a mill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Txakura Posted February 4, 2010 Author Share Posted February 4, 2010 what is it with people and lightened flywheels thinking they'll loose torque? all you are loosing is momentum, which isnt a bad thing. you GAIN torque at the wheels (where it matters) when you lighten the flywheel as less of the engine's power goes into turning the flywheel around and allows it to go to the wheels where you want it. the engine will make no more or less power and thus torque no matter what you do after the engine. I don't think I will magically lose any output from the engine but the inertia of the rotating mass will be different. A heavier flywheel at the same rpm connecting and transmitting more force on initial engagement sounds, intuitively, like it would be better for 4wd applications. Following the adventures on this board, I have decided my 4wd time is 'light duty'. My daily driving has shifted from 60% gravel, snow and mud to less than 1%. (I'm also driving 12 miles per day now, as opposed to 120 last April, and 65 the rest of the year) This is a mod I've always wanted to try and with my grEAsy82 engine coming out fairly soon, this is a good opportunity to work the flywheel, see what that does on the same engine, before going to the ej22. Great input from the crew, believe it or not, hanging out on the XJ board helped me in the decision to sell my XJ. Hanging out here makes me think I will always have a Suub in the fleet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Txakura Posted February 4, 2010 Author Share Posted February 4, 2010 Flywheel spec for XT6 is .815, for an EA-82 .827. But it's the same clutch kit. Doug I got those specs from RHINO whats the spec for an EJ 22? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quidam Posted February 4, 2010 Share Posted February 4, 2010 EJ to EJ, the spec is "FLAT". I'm not sure what would be best EJ to EA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twilightprotege Posted February 4, 2010 Share Posted February 4, 2010 I don't think I will magically lose any output from the engine but the inertia of the rotating mass will be different. A heavier flywheel at the same rpm connecting and transmitting more force on initial engagement sounds, intuitively, like it would be better for 4wd applications. for sure, if you're 4wd'ing i'd say keep the heavy flywheel as it helps keep the engine spinning. even in a drag racing situation, a heavy flywheel is usually better. but in terms of "losing torque" that's all rubbish Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
subiekid Posted February 5, 2010 Share Posted February 5, 2010 I had 7 lbs (stock is 19 iirc) taken off my ea flywheel when I had the ea82t in the turbo wagon, rev matching was wonderful.... taking off from a stop sign with the 6 puck and light flywheel was not so good. With a stock style clutch, I think it would be great. I can no longer use mine (ej now), if someone wants to try it, i'll sell it cheap compared to having a local machine shop do it for you.. I think I paid $75 to lighten, and re-balance. Scott Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Txakura Posted February 5, 2010 Author Share Posted February 5, 2010 I'm not far from you, why can't you use it on your ej? as in, can I use it on my swap? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingbobdole Posted February 9, 2010 Share Posted February 9, 2010 Skip made me a 16 lbs wheel for my ol XT-6 and I loved it, lots more response. FYI a stock XT-6 wheel is 19 lbs... turbos are like 25... When I did my lifted GL's clutch I put the lighter XT-6 flywheel in it.. it's still slow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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