monstaru Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 (edited) EJ251 block ej22 roller rocker heads DElta 200's Everything went together this morning.It won't be in the car until next week. I am a skosch concerned about immeddiately running a motor at 1500 to 2000 RPM's right off of the bat for break in What say ye? HOw do YOU prime your engine ?Bump it over without spark plug wires attached?etc? Cheers Edited December 30, 2011 by monstaru Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 ideally you assemble the heads and cams with assembly lube or at least oil. you didn't install everything dry right? as long as you assembled all the services with lubricant it'll be fine to crank over. that being said - priming is a good idea and doing what you said will do it perfectly - just crank the engine over with the fuel injectors unplugged. that keeps fuel from spraying into the cylinders and washing the oil off the cylinder walls. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monstaru Posted December 24, 2011 Author Share Posted December 24, 2011 (edited) There is plenty of assembly lube , like , lots of it. I was there when it was assembled,I was working on something else... It just makes me nervous.... cheers Edited December 24, 2011 by monstaru Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazyeights Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 It will be fine - just keep it off of a slow idle for the first 10 or 15 minutes to break the cams in. I would also suggest a zinc additive for the oil if the cams are Delta re-grinds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Idasho Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 HOw do YOU prime your engine ?Bump it over without spark plug wires attached?etc? I always do an oil prime with the spark plugs REMOVED. This removes any strain on the bottom end from compression. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Presidente Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 The best way to prime a motor is to turn just the oil pump and leave the rotating assembly alone. I'm not familiar with the EJ251's, as they were new when I was an auto machinist, but if they're pulley driven, put a socket on it and use an air ratchet or drill to turn it till pressure builds up. If they're distributor driven, just grind out a tool that fits in the end or the oil pump driveshaft and chuck it up in a drill. Just make sure you turn it the right way! I always use a cam break-in lube high in ZDDP on all the lobes too to protect the hardfacing, unless its a roller cam then I used standard assembly lube. Once I get it running at idle for a minute or two, I rev it up to 1500-2500rpm and back down again a couple times to get everything used to each other and then its good to go. If its a flat tappet motor like an EA81, you really need to rev it up and down or the lifters willn't turn developing a flat spot killing your cam soon down the road. As far as break-in manners, I go easy the first hundred miles, but after that I drive it like it will normally be driven. If its a DD, I drive it like a DD, if its a hot, fast ballzy motor, I don't hesitate to give it skinny pedal and open up the secondaries. Don't forget your oil changes too! Josh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numbchux Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 EJ oil pumps are driven directly from the crank. No way to spin them independent of each other. I always prime the oil system, even after just an oil change. Just un-plug the crank-angle sensor, and crank until the oil light goes out. There will be compression, but no fuel or spark.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mugs Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 The best way to prime a motor is to turn just the oil pump and leave the rotating assembly alone. I'm not familiar with the EJ251's, as they were new when I was an auto machinist, but if they're pulley driven, put a socket on it and use an air ratchet or drill to turn it till pressure builds up. If they're distributor driven, just grind out a tool that fits in the end or the oil pump driveshaft and chuck it up in a drill. Just make sure you turn it the right way! Josh The oil pump is driven be the crank...as in it slides over the crank...then the crank seal, then the crank gear and next timing components... You prime these engines (and other Japanese engines) by disconnecting the coil and pulling the fuel pump fuse, and then crank until the oil light goes out. Re connect then start and run. I think his concern is, he has basically built a "new" motor. 2.5 block with 2.2 heads and a Delta 200 grind, new timing components, etc. So there is some concern about a fresh start up with the coolant not being purged and nothing else really broken in as well, to just start it up and hit 1500-2000 RPM right out the gate for 15 minutes...but that is what the directions Delta gave...just a little nerve racking, I imagine. Dang you Chux...I was still writing when you posted.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Presidente Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 The oil pump is driven be the crank...as in it slides over the crank...then the crank seal, then the crank gear and next timing components... You prime these engines (and other Japanese engines) by disconnecting the coil and pulling the fuel pump fuse, and then crank until the oil light goes out. Re connect then start and run. I think his concern is, he has basically built a "new" motor. 2.5 block with 2.2 heads and a Delta 200 grind, new timing components, etc. So there is some concern about a fresh start up with the coolant not being purged and nothing else really broken in as well, to just start it up and hit 1500-2000 RPM right out the gate for 15 minutes...but that is what the directions Delta gave...just a little nerve racking, I imagine. Dang you Chux...I was still writing when you posted.... Very cool, learn something new everyday! I wouldn't be worried at all about taking it to 2K soon after getting it running. If its going to blow up doing this, its dead already. I've done the same thing to several motors during break-in and never had one problem. If it was put together right and it has oil pressure, there's no reason to worry about anything. Delta knows their stuff! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monstaru Posted December 24, 2011 Author Share Posted December 24, 2011 Lets get something straight here.I do not doubt Delta's ability to be right.They DO know their ************.I do not doubt much about this entire situation. I simply cannot have it go wrong,So I am a skosch hesitant.thats all. Thanks for everyones input.I will update when she is running. cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numbchux Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 That's an absolutely reasonable concern. I sold an EJ25D short block to a guy this summer. I pulled the block myself, the car drove into the shop before the motor was pulled, it made zero noise. He called me once be got it installed saying it was knocking. I went and had a listen, and sure enough, bottom end noise.... I asked him if he primed the oil system. "Huh?" Coincidence? Maybe... but I think he ruined that motor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Idasho Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 If it was put together right and it has oil pressure, there's no reason to worry about anything. Agreed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted December 25, 2011 Share Posted December 25, 2011 I disconnect the ignitor and the fuel injectors and crank till the oil light goes out (or the gauge rises on older stuff) then give it about 10 more seconds of cranking to insure I'm up to full oil pressure. Reconnect everything and fire it up. I do this on all engines that have sat for long periods or are brand new. GD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazyeights Posted December 26, 2011 Share Posted December 26, 2011 So you can get enough cranking speed to do this with the plugs still in? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monstaru Posted December 26, 2011 Author Share Posted December 26, 2011 So you can get enough cranking speed to do this with the plugs still in? Why wouldn't you?Full battery, and good starter inclusive? Anyways, good info.We are on track then. cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numbchux Posted December 26, 2011 Share Posted December 26, 2011 So you can get enough cranking speed to do this with the plugs still in? You're not going to get it up to "full" pressure with the starter (with or without the plugs in). But it will get above the ~7psi required for the oil light, and you will get quite a bit of oil circulation, make sure all the air is out, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monstaru Posted December 27, 2011 Author Share Posted December 27, 2011 Tomorrow is the day!!:headbang:I appreciate the advice.We should stickie this! I know it is basic information, but rather helpful. I am glad to know that we might know what we are doing.:-p I'll take video of it running cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monstaru Posted December 28, 2011 Author Share Posted December 28, 2011 (edited) It runs! Primed her, ran her at 1800 ish for about 20 minutes. She purs , aside from the clack 'o'valve.Will adjust when suitable. I WILL run it hard.I promise. I am excited to drive it, but there are a couple small mechanical issues to be worked out. Right after priming.Going for it.The pit in my stomach was horrible. Then finally: cheers Edited December 28, 2011 by monstaru Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Idasho Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 Sweet :cool: Its always a great feeling to get a motor back together and running smooth. A confident "fresh start" of sorts I saw the title "uh oh" on the vid and was half expecting a nice motor knock or something Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monstaru Posted December 29, 2011 Author Share Posted December 29, 2011 Sweet :cool: Its always a great feeling to get a motor back together and running smooth. A confident "fresh start" of sorts I saw the title "uh oh" on the vid and was half expecting a nice motor knock or something UH-OH is the title of the folder on Photobucket Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mugs Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 Yes it was quite a nerve racking few minutes..."I hope this thing doesn't blow" but once the break-in was done...the nerves were more at rest...Hell I was glad/relieved to just hear it start. Now If I can just figure out how to adjust valves I think "we" may be off about .001 (as per monstaru diagnosis) which means the factory specs are out not quite accurate for the cams/hypo motor. Other than that the thing is screamer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monstaru Posted December 29, 2011 Author Share Posted December 29, 2011 We got her licked....Well the engine at least.I'll get in there , and see what is going on with the valves. Anybody got the valve specs? cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flight_of_pain Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 Awesome! I just assembled a similar frankenmotor for my legwag. I used an ej25d shortblock and ej223 heads (single year '99, roller rocker, single port). I put it together the week before christmas, started it on the 22nd, and just got back from driving it to Seattle then Port Angeles. I always pull the coil wires and crank until oil pressure is built, then start it up. As for valves, this is the fsm specs for 99 phase 2 heads. (essentially the same heads as sohc 2.5) Valve clearance Intake mm (in) 0.20±0.02 (0.0079±0.0008) Exhaust mm (in) 0.25±0.02 (0.0098±0.0008) Happy motoring! Isaac Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mugs Posted December 31, 2011 Share Posted December 31, 2011 As for valves, this is the fsm specs for 99 phase 2 heads. (essentially the same heads as sohc 2.5) Valve clearance Intake mm (in) 0.20±0.02 (0.0079±0.0008) Exhaust mm (in) 0.25±0.02 (0.0098±0.0008) Happy motoring! Isaac Ya that is what "we" set them at, and they still clack like a mother. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flight_of_pain Posted January 1, 2012 Share Posted January 1, 2012 Ya that is what "we" set them at, and they still clack like a mother. I have run them at intake .15mm exhaust .20mm with no ill effects, paired with a 4eat it doesn't get revved out much. I have found oil makes a bigger difference, Mobil Delvac or castrol gtx is what i run in my subes. The mobil is for the clackety ones Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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