3eyedwagon

That makes sense. I was just thinking of grabbing a handfull of them at PAP, and testing them when I get home. I am going to compare readings first. His house is just 1 hour away. So, I'm already 2/3 of the way to the junkyard. I figured it wouldn't make a difference, but just wanted to make sure. I figured it may make a difference to measure conductivity between A-B with the prescribed measurements. I'll take my M M with me. Thanks a ton guys. I'm outta here. I'll let you know how all goes!

Alright. Thanks. I'm headed to PAP to get another one. Is testing these off of the vehicle using a screw driver in place of the throttle shaft advised, or should I leave the TPS on the car in favor of testing the initial TPS placement settings as well? I'm not sure how much that will account into the other readings, if at all.

I figured those readings were way too high, I just figured that maybe there was a typo in Daeron's procedure (you never know). If there is a consensus that the correct range is in the Ks, I'm definitely convinced of my idea. That's one of the strangest parts, I can't seem to get any codes from the ECU other than the 5 flashes. It seems to me a stumbling of the motor would trip something.... I'm anxiously awaiting my trip down to investigate another TPS:)

Thanks guys. I'm headed down here in a bit to test one on a car that I know runs, and drives well. Jeff is kind enough to let me use his Touring Wagon as a guinea pig.... I'll compare the readings I get, but I'm really running out of things it could be. If Jeff's measures more consistently, and stable than mine; it looks like a trip to Pull-A-Part.

I'm headed down to Jeff's tonight to compare the test results I get from his TPS, on a car that is known to run just fine. But I am wondering if any of you know; How frequently do TP sensors actually fail? The car I am dealing with is at 275k on the clock, and from the somewhat random results I have received (see above posts); I am beginning to lean in this direction. However, with new sensors costing so much, and the nearest junkyard a 1.5 hour drive; I want to be sure before I head out hunting for a new one! Any help would be met with a tearful hug at this point... Thanks in advance!

you caught me skimming. that'll happen.

Also, thoroughly clean the threads with pentrating lube before you even start. This will save you some time turning a nut 1/4 turn at a time over gritty crap.

I have been testing my TPS using Daeron's write up. http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/showthread.php?t=79393 I have encountered a few problems. While measuring resistance between posts B and D; I cannot get a measurement OF ANY SORT. I have tried using multiple Ohm settings on my multi-meter, and have been unable to get any type of reading. I have considered the fact that placement of posts may be different, as described in the write up. Trying combinations of other posts results in no readings as well, with the exception of posts A-B, as mentioned in the post. All in all, I believe my testing procedures are being performed correctly. The sweep resistance readings between posts B and C have been measurable, but not in the #4 K Ohm setting as described. They have only been measurable in the 4, and 40 M Ohm settings. However, they have swept continuously as described in the test procedure. I am wondering if the lack of reading regarding post B and D means that my TPS is no good? The symptoms are listed in my above post. UPDATE I have been finding the testing of this sensor to be very hit or miss. It seems to depend on which time I test it as to the readings I receive. I am getting a little frustrated :-\ . The car has sat for awhile after re-timing it (read; it has cooled down), and I then used the same procedure to re-test the TPS. All measurements are still only readable in M ohms, rather than K ohms as described in Daeron's procedure. With everything cool, the resting resistance of posts B-D measures from 3.2ish M Ohms to around 5.5 M Ohms. Now, the sweep of posts B-C has changed dramatically. There is not much change in the resistance while operating the throttle linkage. Is this a normal change after letting the sensor cool? Are there other test procedures I am over looking? any help would be great, as I am beginning to get a bit frazzled.

Your 92 Loyale would have an EA82. The EA81 is completely different engine, used in the early 80s in what is known as the 2nd generation Subaru. These were equipped with a 4 speed dual range transmission. Not all, but alot. They are the "roundier" more attractive ones. That's just my opinion though. The EA81s are a pushrod engine and the camshaft is timed/driven using gears, whereas the EA82s are overhead cam, and timed/driven using timing belts. There are many other differences, but this is the principle one. Your Loyale is what would be known as a 3rd generation, or EA82. Thusly, you would want to find a 5 speed dual range transmission from a 1985-1989 Subaru of some sort. Good luck!

No secret weapon Scott. Just a beater ea82 spfi wagon, with a one day 2incher, and some tube bumpers (if I conjure the motivation to work, after work, in this heat:dead: :-p ) I got it to keep me entertained, and in the wheeling while I work on fixing my wagon, and building a new project. Plus, it is something to save some wear, and tear on my nice wagon, and hatch. I am however going to get the tires for the new wagon tonight. That has me kinda grinning.

Wow, Sucks that this has turned into this deal all over again, and I honestly mean that to all parties involved. I was honestly looking at having an enlightening conversation this go round, and I think it was well headed on the right track. I think my best option at this point is to only address the topics which I find interesting, and ignore all those I don't find enjoyable. Seems pretty common sense to me. I agree that for the most part, you are probably correct in your opinion. I totally agree with you that the majority of "trucks" sold today are nothing more than a shiney trinket designed to make the owner feel "different" from the rest of the crowd. I do however believe that there is room for AT LEAST the option of a straight axle light truck in todays market. While they may not sell AT ALL in the more urban areas, I do believe they would have great success in the more rural towns, such as the area I live in. My brother, two of his friends, and I were some of the first to put straight axles under the 1994 era Toyota pickups. The first two were full custom jobs, then we found the AllPro weld in kits. Since then, we have done a few more of these jobs. I cannot believe how popular they have become, and not even with the strictly wheeling crowd. There are numerous examples cruising around my valley that look like nearly stock pickups, with the exception of a solid front axle. People have payed GOOD money to have this work done, and not always for a huge offroad machine. Many just want a solid commuter with more capabilities than their stock IFS system, and the amenities of a newer pickup. From what I have seen; there is room for this to be an option on some light trucks, and I honestly believe some auto manufacterers (ESPECIALLY Toyota) are really missing out. Eric, I'm not sure that you understand my sense of humor, or something is being lost in the interwebs. I think you have honestly confused my sense of amusement with upset/anger. I think any of my friends can back me up as to the sincerity of my completely lackadaisical attitude. Just ask Jeff. I must read as a complete, and utter serious Ahole, but almost all of this is written with a grin on my face. I cannot be more honest when I state; At the end of the day, I do not give a flying leap about what anyone is up to, unless it risks my reputation, those of my friends, or threatens any of my friends in any way. There are people out there ruining each, and every recreation. Be it fly fishing or hot air ballooning, there is somebody out there right now ruinging it, and somebody like me laughing, and shaking their head about how they are doing so. Like I said earlier, I think the drive to make that CASH plays alot into it. This a philosophy/theory that I'd be happy to further explain, in a better time/better place. But the short version is this: The more money is involved in a hobby, the more likely the chance of it being completely ruined by idiots. The greater the chance of profits, the lower the percentage of true compassion. I still think the picture was a poor choice, and a chance to "twist the knife". I personally would have done without it. I would've gotten the point. I had kinda forgotten about this Chris. That lady was THE PERFECT EXAMPLE of how wheelers should be. There could not have been a kinder person, that was more grounded or humble, despite the fact of an incredibly nice vehicle. She was a great balance of helpfullness mixed with the cautionary advice that this shouldn't be an on-going occurence. It really could not have been handled much better on her behalf. Alot of people could take note of the kind of attitude that lady portrayed. As someone who has been on both ends of this spectrum multiple times; I can both understand, and condemn your idea here. I've been the one both leading the pack, constantly waiting for the "weakest link", and the "weakest link" holding up the entire pack. Neither is a very enviable situation. I do however think there are reasonable ways to handle the situation. My opinion is that EVERYONE DESERVES AN OPPORTUNITY to go wheeling. I don't care if you are driving a custom built, coil springed tube buggy, or an Automagic Subaru station wagon. Everyone should get to go wheeling. While I understand the burden that it is being one of the more capable vehicles, I also think that it is a responsibilty to help out the less capable guy. Whether it be teaching them how to operate a come-a-long (someone had to teach me), or just helping them get their stuff home. I'm not saying that it is the responsibilty of the more capable vehicles / operators to ensure that everyone has a good time, and makes it everywhere on the mountain. However, taking along a "new guy" in a less than capable vehicle is something the should be done at least once. Obviously the guy doesn't get a life pass, and unlimited pull-outs, but the first trip is a freebie. I'm honestly happy to take new guys out, and help them learn how everything works. Things like picking lines, safe vehicle recovery tips, trail preparedness, etc. I mean after all, I didn't start out wheeling in a full out trail rig, with a firm grasp of the necessary tricks. Plus, you never know when you may need to call that person in the middle of the night to help you get your junk home (I've had to use this one once)

This is Off Topic, I know, but isn't that how this thread got started? I was thinking about it today, and came up with a quandry. How is it that NO auto manufacturers today offer a: small pickup - Inline 4,5 or 6, or V6 WITH: a solid front axle. ?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? With the popularity of pre 86 Toyotas, and the other similar light designs, how can auto manufacturers not at least offer this as an option? The only possible reason I can come up with the is test standards set by the NHTSA (I think thats them). Even still, a sprung under, solid front axle light pickup would have to be passable. It sure seems to me that people would buy them. You could sell enough of the Toyotas in Sedro-Woolley to pay for the whole project! I can think of a bunch of great candidates: GM's Colorado platform Ford's Ranger Toyota's Tacoma Nissan's Frontier There are others, those are just some examples

That, I actually have some respect for. A: It's a wrong year LandLoser (It's a little different), making it not something you'd see EVERY SINGLE DAY. B: If he actually did the work; he knows alot about it. -What it's capable of -What the weak points are -How to get it home That's not the kind of rig, or person you see stuck somewhere just waiting for help of some sort, and I'd be willing to bet he doesn't have a huge head about it either.

I would never go as far as to compare ABS with fuel injection, or electrical ignition. Both were greeted with open arms by the performance community. I guess you have me there. I'll be certain to make sure every airliner I purchase from now on has ABS. And yes, some race cars do use ABS, alot of them actually. But the systems in place on race cars are "slightly" improved over anything you will ever practically swap into an EA car. Just because it is so, doesn't make it right. I never said I was against technology, or safer driving systems. However, I am in favor of people having a slight command of the 1.5 ton metal block they are controlling on the road next to me. I guess I could see how my encouragement for someone to take the time to actually learn things like "panic braking" could be misconstrued as luddism. But let me assure you; that isn't the case. I just generally think it a good idea for people to actually have some control over the car they are driving, no matter what braking system it has on it. Just think, some day I will be ranting over someone installing "lane maintaining sensors" on a 2009 Forrester.... you know, for safetys sake. Just another opinion, But like I previously said; Go find some deserted pavement, and PRACTICE, PRACTICE, PRACTICE. Do so in all conditions possible. It may save your life, and it can even be a little bit of fun.

I have set the ignition base timing (with the test connectors plugged together) to 20* btdc, and have narrowed the problems down to only one. The car runs well at both idle, and high rpms. It will even rev well under no load, IF you tease the throttle. However, if you full out punch the throttle, the engine will stall, and sputter. If you do not lift, it will sometimes die. If you lift lightly, the engine will begin to catch up, and eventually rev past the trouble range of 2,500-3,500 rpm. I have read Daeron's Throttle Postitioning sensor post, and I am going to test to see if it is operating correctly. Other than that, I am beginning to run out of ideas. Anyone out there have any?

Thanks. That makes feel better. Way to represent Rob. Here's to Subaru's greatest generation!

Sorry for jacking your thread Rob. Had to stick up for my 2nd gen though. And Toyota??? I mean seriously!! I'm done.

Nice choice of picture. If you like "not worrying about it" you had better just be happy with it how it is. I will gladly admit, Toyotas are a more reliable simple wheeler, that is until you start to reach their upper limit. You think changing a CV is fun, wait until you start getting into Birfield joints. My personal best is 21 minutes on the front driver, but that took a few "practice sessions". As far as the build cost. I would have to guess that is all relative. I don't know how you came up with $4500 to build a brat. My wagon has less than a grand in it finished. It may run up to $1500 with improvements, but that's going to be a high guess. That is also WITH the cost of original purchase of the car. I guess a guy could spend $25,000 building a brat, and $500 building a Toy. Or vice versa. It is all really up to the person. Who's the elitist now? That's like saying; "You can't say BMW owners are like Mercedes Benz owners." As the former owner of multiple Toyotas, AND multiple Jeeps; I would like to think I was just as much of an @**hole no matter what I was driving! I've never had the attitude that Subaru owners are better than anyone else. I do however gladly have the attitude that those willing to try something a little more difficult, work a little harder for a little less, make something out of nothing, expiriment with building their own stuff no matter what it is, or how horribly it may fail are better than the rest. Plain, and simple. I don't really give a crap about what anyone drives. Chances are that I've owned or driven the same thing before. I only pick on Toyota because soooo many of their owners (especially in this area) are such a PRIME example of complete, and utter ignorance. The kind of ignorance that really should be the target of natural selection. Tuff Country shocks, Wild Country tires, as many lights as the alternator will power, two CB whips, and an aluminum dog box does not a wheeler make. I cannot stop laughing when I see these guys on their side every single winter. So, unless you are the guy that bought his entire lift kit at Les Schwab on his Visa, then insists on charging up every trail with 15 lights on at Noon with chew spit running down the door, and insists on the fact that the Toyota 22r/re is the single greatest vehicle ever built, despite having never turned a wrench on one; don't take it too personal when I rank on your Toyotas. Odds are that I've owned a few, I know their weaknesses like you know the Soobs, and I know the biggest weakness is how much you guys hate it when people speak poorly of them.:-p

You are comparing apples, and hand grenades. Pull that EJ Put that FI motor back in, and then say that. Also, GD makes a good point. I don't want to have to cut every last piece off of the car just to get it to go. If that were the case, I'd just build a full out tube buggy with a 4.3 v6, 60 front, and Corporate 14 rear. Then I'd go buy me a nice shiney trailer. And things like gas are kinda necessary when wheeling....:-\ I'm a fat guy too; I suppose I should probably leave my *** at the trail head. My point is, a little gear is necessary. Without it, you aren't wheeling safely. I think I figured out why the 3rd gens don't break axles.....

Couldn't agree more. This third gen only comes as a form of amusement while I find better things. :-p AND as soon as I find the right hatch, that is what I fully intend to build. I just can't bring myself to cut up a pretty little hatch to go wheeling in, and there seems to be very little middle ground in the hatch market. Either they are super nice (like the one I have), or they are rusted to the point where they are beyond even attempting. SO, for now my EA81 wagon will have to do for the 2nd gen toys. I'd still gladly take its abilities vs. problems over the power output of this SPFI motor coupled with the heftyness of the too large 3rd gen body. I've already unbolted enough wasted steel to make at least the quarters for a good hatch back! Anyways, The whole point of this car is a cheap wheeler that I won't feel a bit bad about creasing the quarters in on. Therefor, I don't see much point in an EJ swap, or extensive engine upgrades. Especially considering the fact that I don't have any idea how long this car may even last. So, I'm just looking for the simplest upgrades possible. Preferably free. I don't care if it makes 1/2 of a horse, I'm game. Anything helps right? As usual, thanks for any info GD.

The bottom one has all its' marker lights.

We'd love to have you come on up Rob. I'll even buy you a Coke:slobber: .... that's how generous of a guy I am:grin:

Figured no point in starting a new thread.... Maybe some of you EA82 gurus can help me out on getting a little more power out of this mean machine.... As before -89 EA82 SPFI- +*Thanks to McDave for helping me find the incredibly simple fix of unpluggin the test connectors*+ I'm still chuckling about that... This car will be mostly for wheeling, and thusly I am looking to get it into to solid running condition. I am honestly concerned about the motors ability to turn any kind of over sized tire. I guess maybe I'm a little used to my EA81 with a Weber, but this thing seems SUPER doggy. I intend to replace the plugs, I figure it'll need to be done after running incredibly rich for lord knows how long. It also needs to be timed. But, above that; I am looking for simple tricks to improve performance, and get every bit I can out of the engine. I've already started removing every last thing I can from around the engine to hopefully improve air flow. Now I am wondering what can be removed from the engine in favor of weight savings ("Worry about the ounces, and the pounds will come"), and what all is on there that just plain isn't needed. Can I remove things like the charcoal canister? Will removing/empyting the catalytic converter result in problems? What else can be done above, and beyond a good tune? As usual; any, and all help is much appreciated!

It hasn't happened yet.... It's the 23rd I believe.

Well, thanks everyone! It is running pretty well. It lacks a little power in the 2,000-4,000 rpm range, it pops/sputters on occassion under initial WOT, and that hot smokey smell seems to continue, but all, and all; I think it will work just fine for what I intend to do to it. I have removed the thermostat in an attempt to cool it down, and have wired the fan to a good 12v ignition power source. I really want this car to run cool. Nothing annoys me more than keeping an eye on the temp gauge. I think it needs to be timed, and tinkered with. But overall, it is in fair operating condition. I think I'm going to wait on the picture. I'll take a couple now for the before, and after shot. I'll post them all up once it has been properly chopped up for larger tires.