FlyB0y Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 Ok, if you have heard of this product, you probubly thought the same thin I did .... " A $150 catch-bottle?!?! " Well, I talked to a few people and one was a mechanic who claimed he noticed an increase in power in his engine and going onto the freeway his automatic didn't have to shift as low to go up the on-ramp he took every day. Then a friend at work got one so I did some investigating ... he claimed a small gain in MPG and decient power increase. So then I thought, what really IS special about this device opposed to a simple catch-bottle you have to put on the crank vent tube when you race a motorcycle? Well, according to one of the local dealers, it's the unique small silica beads inside the "screen door" mesh filter with tiny dimples you see on golf balls. The theory is that blow-by from your crank vent goes through a special minimal flow restrictive filter that collects all the bad stuff (Oil,water, dirt etc.) and it drips to the bottom of the bottle while the fuel/air mixture goes out the vent in the top of the bottle, which recycles the fuel that escaped past the rings into the crank, minus all the bad stuff. So I decided to make one out of my old charcole filter canister (I have a weber now so I removed all the smog creating junk :-p) I made a very simple filter out of a spagetti sauce can, two small screen mesh strainers ( like a smaller version of the basket type metal screen strainers for cooking pasta ) one the diameter of the can and one slightly smaller with a scotch-bright dish scrubber in-between. Here are the results: I have a BIG hill to go over when I travel from Lolo MT to Missoula MT. It's on I-90, and after a gental rise and a couple gental curves there is a long level straight-away before a long steep hill. With my newly cleaned and re-built weber carb just a few days earlier on thursday, I had to make the typical running start to about 85 MPH just to maintain 65 - 70 throught this hill. Last Sunday I had installed my proto-type and made the same run. To make it interesting I didn't speed up to 85 untill the last minute and was not only able to make 85 MPH much faster in a shorter distance than usual, I also KEPT 85 MPH THROUGH THE TURN!!! I had annother test on a steep slippery corse gravel road in the woods I have tried with my brat. On previous attempts I had to lean-out the carb a bit to keep from bogging-out 2/3s of the way up this hill and run in 4-low and 1st gear to power up it (It's at about a 35-40 DEG) with just my 13" all seasons. After I tried it with the Condensator I was able to shift into second just as I was at the bottom of the hill and make it 9/10s of the way up in second gear!! Now before you get any ideas with that old charcloe canister, here's a MUCH simpler way and better way to make your own "condensator" I was at a sporting goods store when I saw this and got the idea ... you can goto www.liquid-solutions.com to get the same camping tea mug that I am using to make my final version of my home-made "condensator". It's under coffee and tea products and it's called the "Tea-zer". Here's the deal ... the basket strainer fits under the screw-on lid, and makes the perfect filter basket! For this one I will experiment with fine steel wool and some of the stainless steel pot scrubbers (these are alot more coarse) and some brass pipe fittings. Just take a hole saw open up the lid you drink from all the way up and drill a hole in the top of the screw-on lid for the crank vent hose to come in. Take the strainer basket and poke some more holes on the sides, not the bottom, to increase the air-flow with a small nail with a piece of wood inside the basket as a back-board. Next put a small 1/4" to 1/2" patch of steel wool/scubbing pad on the bottom of the basket. Lastly, make a hole on the side as near to the top as you can just through both walls to make a vent for the fuel/air gases to escape, this is where it connects to the line going to the PCV valve which is connected to the intake. The nice thing about this too is that if at any time you decide to remove it, simply un-plug it and route the hose as normal and nothing of the original stuff had to be modified Here's some interesting info about the "condensator" http://www.condensatorsales.com/ An interesting EPA lab test of the "condensator" grrrrrrrrrrrr!! my boss's computer can't handle adobe acrobat I will try and find that test later but I believe it said that on OTR diesel engines and other large diesel's they saw an increase of 15 - 25% on MPG over the standard practice of venting the same stuff to the atmosphere (road draft tube) Dayn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[HTi]Johnson Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 I'm gunna have to try that. I saw a home made one on a 2.5 RS...i was wondering what the heck it was. Wait, what's the charcoal can for? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TurboSPFI Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 pics? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nkx Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 is this also known as an oil catch can? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlyB0y Posted June 21, 2005 Author Share Posted June 21, 2005 I have an '85 Brat, and it had all the emissions gear known on it, including a charcoal canister that is suppose to absorb gas fumes escaping from your carb/gas tank. I just thought that was a good place to put a condinsator since I had a spot for it and it would be easy to strap down. I'm sorry, no pics yet, have to see if I can get my boss to let me borrow his digi cam for that, mine isn't much good and isn't set up for his comp ... can't wait to be on-line with my own computer soon... Yes it is alot like a oil catch can, but the differance is it is sealed, has a filter and allows the un-burnt fuel vapor in the blow-by that the catch can would hold to be taken back into the intake, thus more power and better fuel ecomomy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
habib99 Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 I LOVE the fact that you've made something from bits and bobs -and then got it working -your road tests sound great. Surely everyone will want to try this out after all if it doesnt work you can just take it off! What about turbo models - cant think it through without looking at the engine but wouldnt it interfere with the EGR/PCV systems? Good luck and thanks for sharing your inovation Habib Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archemitis Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 you cant feel a power increase from this. its just practical, not performance. keeps your intake cleaner, no hp gains. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samo Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 Made one out of a can of Foster's and some steel wool. Zero power increase, but man the inside of my intake is clean! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lastchance Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 SAMO! HAHAHA that's awesome! Ya, oil catch cans for turbocharged cars (with IC's) are a HUGE plus, keeping all the gunk and carbon outta the intercooler...Like someone else said, no power gain, but definately worth 10 bucks worth of parts from home depot...Or $110 for a pretty polished Greddy or GBX! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KStretch55 Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 I've heard that real Aussies don't drink Fosters and always wondered what else you did with it. Now I know and it looks great, but I hope you didn't waste the beer anyway. LOL The only bad beer is wasted beer!! Ok, so where does it go? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markman34 Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 I've just hooked my new canister made from a peanut butter jar up to the car. Maybe it'll help with sperattic oil burning problems that I have. I need a tee for the hose to collect all crankcase gasses to go through the filter but this is a start! I'll take a picture and post it when I break it in a bit! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All_talk Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 you cant feel a power increase from this. its just practical, not performance.keeps your intake cleaner, no hp gains. Well yes… but maybe not. Consider the case of an engine with significant blow-by/case pressure that ingests enough oil to degrade performance. Turbo cars (high mileage) are especially prone to this because the oil acts to reduce the effective octane rating of the air/fuel mixture and causes detonation. I such a case you could see a slight performance increase with the oil removed from the mixture. Gary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KStretch55 Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 Ahhh, so it goes between the PCV valve and the "T" to the valve covers? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wasteland Posted June 21, 2005 Share Posted June 21, 2005 Am I wrong or does this work just like an inline moisture trap for an air compresor? If so pipe fittings will thread right on and they can be had for cheap from Harbor freight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBrumby Posted June 22, 2005 Share Posted June 22, 2005 I've heard that real Aussies don't drink Fosters and always wondered what else you did with it. Now I know and it looks great, but I hope you didn't waste the beer anyway. LOL The only bad beer is wasted beer!! Ok, so where does it go? foster's had gone downhill a long time ago, my dad recons, its pretty hard to find it here unless you goto a big bottle'o. victoria bitter and xxxx bitter would porbably be the highest sellers here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[HTi]Johnson Posted June 22, 2005 Share Posted June 22, 2005 That Fosters can is cool. Yeah here in the States Fosters is Austraillian for beer. Or so that's what they market it as to us. Always showing Austraillians doing some crazy thing then going to the slogan "Fosters- Austraillian for beer" I thought it was dumb. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ausubaru92 Posted June 22, 2005 Share Posted June 22, 2005 I work in a grocery store (IGA) on a saturday arvo and serve in the bottle'o and our biggest seller is prob Tooheys New, then VB. Well dont sell that much fosters, we actually sell more 'fosters lightice'. I actually dont drink much beer, im more of a Rum and Coke guy Thats my blab:drunk: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
habib99 Posted June 22, 2005 Share Posted June 22, 2005 Dont mean to distract from all the beer talk!!..... but between where and where does the catch tank connect - one suggestion above but not 100% thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All_talk Posted June 22, 2005 Share Posted June 22, 2005 The catch tank goes between the suction source(s) and the case outlet. Suction is applied to the PCV system from two sources, the PCV valve and a connection in the intake tract before the throttle plate or turbo inlet. The case outlet varies by motor, EJs and the EA82T are on the left rear top of the block, carbed EA82 use the drivers side valve cover, I’m not sure about the SPFI and EA81(T). Some general notes on building an effective catch can… Volume: for the heavier particulates and droplets to fall out you need to slow down the flow, bigger is better. Cooling: vapors will condense better at lower temperatures, locate the can away from heat sources or use heat shields. Surface area: the vapors will condense more easily on a surface, this is the reason for the screen or filter material (I think course steel wool would be my choice). Height: gravity works, a taller chamber will give more effective separation. General layout: suction line at the top, case line low but not bottom, below “filter media”. And it should be easy to remove or have an accessible drain for clean out. Gary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlyB0y Posted June 25, 2005 Author Share Posted June 25, 2005 Here is something interesting to concider: A carbed engine is less efficent in fuel delivery, and the older designs (EA-81 in my case) will have more blow-by and more un-burnt fuel in the blow-by than an injected engine, therefore, it would make sense that a FI engine will see much less power/fuel economy increase than a carbed engine. I am testing my new design with the tea-brewing bottle on my boss's '91 Ford Exploder (Explorer :-p ) to see how much if any change he gets on a long trip (approx 1800 - 1900 miles total) Oddly enough the "condensator" is said to take approx 1800 miles of use before a noticeable gain is apparent. All I know is, this makes for a great bolt-on gas mileage increaser and I have noticed a big increase in power I made the filter as close in apparent design as I could from common items. I noticed that it was a very un-restrictive free-flowing design, and I actually concidered a air line dryer first, but I saw most localy for sale at $45+ and they were way too small to get near the volume of the "condinsator" Also, just annother thing to note: some models of "condinsators" have a one-way checkvalve, so some of you might have to look-up if your model of car would require one (just ask if the one sold for your car model requires one ) And just as a side note I have talked to some people who have just taken a large fuel filter with a drain at the bottom gave similar results. Just think of this as the exiting hose from your crank case breather that goes into a filter and the filter is inside a bottle and once this is filtered, the liquids collect on the filter media, allowing the vaporized fuel/air mixture to exit out of a vent in the top which is then connected to the intake manifold (the same hose line already attached this way ... your simply extending this line and putting the "condensator" in-line with this) Have fun! Let me know if anyone comes up with a easier or more efficient design from common cheap items Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markman34 Posted June 25, 2005 Share Posted June 25, 2005 Here are the pics of my pb jar. It hasn't collected any grime yet but I get good flow. The filter feeds both the pcv valve and the intake boot. It all looks pretty slick for a peanut butter jar. Does anyone think there are fire hazards because of the plastic jar? Flammable gasses in the pcv system? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlyB0y Posted June 26, 2005 Author Share Posted June 26, 2005 Here are the pics of my pb jar. It hasn't collected any grime yet but I get good flow. The filter feeds both the pcv valve and the intake boot. It all looks pretty slick for a peanut butter jar. Does anyone think there are fire hazards because of the plastic jar? Flammable gasses in the pcv system? Looks good Mark! I will post my creation soon as my boss returns and I can get a pic of the one I put in his exploder ... As far as a Fire hazard goes, well just remember your not putting anything into that jar that wasn't already in the PCV line already, and the official "condinsator" is made of plastic too, just make sure it's in an area that doesn't get too hot ... the cooler the gasses are when they are going back into the intake the better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcs Posted June 30, 2005 Share Posted June 30, 2005 This seems too easy. Has anyone thought about simply using a large fuel filter or am I missing something ? No one has said anything about having to empty it out so I guess the liquid/debrie is minimal Looks good Mark! I will post my creation soon as my boss returns and I can get a pic of the one I put in his exploder ... As far as a Fire hazard goes, well just remember your not putting anything into that jar that wasn't already in the PCV line already, and the official "condinsator" is made of plastic too, just make sure it's in an area that doesn't get too hot ... the cooler the gasses are when they are going back into the intake the better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlyB0y Posted June 30, 2005 Author Share Posted June 30, 2005 This seems too easy. Has anyone thought about simply using a large fuel filter or am I missing something ? No one has said anything about having to empty it out so I guess the liquid/debrie is minimal Yes, you can just put in a large fuel filter, however, I believe it makes a differance how much volume the cooling area has, i.e. the more area you have for cooling, the more the heavy stuff like oil and water will have a chance to collect on the filter media and fall to the bottom. In theory, the vaporized fuel/air should not be stopped by the filter much, and will continue on. With my set-up, to clean it (recommened at every oil change) you simply open the tea brewer and dump it out. I have been using regular steel wool, so I might have to replace that too each cleaning (it will rust). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexb1 Posted July 7, 2005 Share Posted July 7, 2005 can someone post some picturs of the inside so you can see the filter in it.i want to do it on my 88 dl ea71 engine, and on this engine you allso have one line to the air filter box , so where do i conect this one? one more question , on the condensator made from a beer can wat is the third litle pipe in the midle for? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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