Qman

That belongs to Jesse(jbbvw) A friend of mine. It does quite well.

I want to thank everyone who braved the windchill! Damn, it was cold. We had a good turn out despite the cold. We had snow all the way up from Greenwater. The food idea seemed to be very welcomed. Maybe we'll keep doing it. The fire was the best place to be. Turbone and I brought up a couple of propane heaters that actually kept flaming out due to the wind. Thanks to Jon from Delta for the hot apple cider and for putting on some pants! You were making everyone cold just looking at you. Thanks to Eriksport for the cobbler... it was great. And, we outlasted the folks from the BBQ!! J/K Dave.

Just finished up the Outback Had to do head gaskets at 161K. Oh well, it's done now. Snows on in the AM and finish loading. See everyone at McDonalds.

Only 4 or 5 people are out. Usually have that every year. No worries. There will be lots of people there to play with.

Yes, retro-fit forum. Look for 5 lug conversion. Can you show us some pics of the 15" 4 lug wheels please.

Snowing in Enumclaw!! Looks lilke we may get some fresh stuff on the hill!!

I doubt we will have much at lower elevations. But there is plenty up higher.

'90's?... I had test pipes on my V-8 Monza in the 80's. Test/track pipes have been around for a long time. anti-foulers have been around for far longer than that.

I was there Sat. There is snow at the higher elevations. I am hoping for a bit more by Sunday.

True, but the book smart people who told me I couldn't do it is what motivates me!

True, very funny depending on the context.

I tend to not cite science when I reply to this type of post. I prefer to cite actual hands on reference. I am not a scientist or an engineer. But, I am a very successful fabricator. I have been very fortunate in all my Subaru builds. Working knowledge is far superior to book knowledge or theory IMHO!

Yes, Rick does debate just to debate. I also answered the question. I also stated that I do not have the "evidence" he wants. Do you have something sound to add or are you just adjusting post count? There is a ton of information out there if you or Rick so choose to explore it. But, use it in the context it is being suggested from the OP. Not through V-6/8 forums. I never challenged him for science or research to back up his statements. I simply stated that my working knowledge of the product may be better than his "research" of something he has not seen or used. Or, for that matter, ever plans to use.

Absolute scientific definition... I don't have it. I have working knowledge of it. I have seen them increase power, ever so slightly. That is all I need to know. I do not need to know the rest or be able to put it down on "paper". Take it for that or not. It is your choice. I don't need to debate these facts.

Atomization occurs in the cylinder not the runner in a MPFI. The TB spacer allows the velocity to increase slightly before entering the manifold. Which will increase said velocity. Which will increase air speed going into the cylinder over the stock design. It is not a 100 shot bolt-on. It is simply another piece to the puzzle that allows a little more power to be gained. When searching for power, small gains anywhere they can be found will make the difference in winning or losing sometimes. One-hundreth of a second wins races. Sometimes that is all that is needed.

Why must you always go one step too far? I mean really? My point was not that you are a "bad" man. My point was not that it does eliminate the problem. My point was simply that it is wrong and does not "fix" the problem. Frag, your O2 sensor is still in the system. Correct depth and sitting in the exhaust stream. Doing it's job as designed and required. You can laugh about it but the fact is any modification can be fined. It doesn't take a LEO to fine you. I would hope that you are not that naive. I am also not saying that I am above such mods. Simply that it is wrong. It amazes me(it shouldn't by now) that the same ones keep showing up.

All you are doing is removing the 2nd O2 from the system. It now appears that the cat is working correctly. Which it isn't. You won't get the code any more. But the problem still exsists. You have fixed nothing. My objection is that it is illegal. In any state that has an inspection it can result in a fine. It is fine that you do it. But, you can not tell someone to do that as the correct fix. That is why I see it as a band-aid.

"V" engines do not use intake spacers. Therefore, they can not know how they work on "their" application as there is not one!

It takes 10 minutes to install. Any gains make it worthwhile. Air temps are lower therefore making the charge temps lower. The TB spacer is for extra velocity. The intake spacers are for lower intake temps. It seems your fan club is going to your head Rick. You used to research a lot more than this in the past!! And yes, I have seen this on the dyno. It is a small gain by itself. When coupled with other mods it makes a significant difference.

Simply stating, Rick, you are wrong this time. Read up some more and you may find the "right" info!

We finally agree about something!! Seriously, there is hard proof that TB spacers work as well as intake spacers. Opinions without actual knowledge of something is just that, an opinion. TB spacers, intakes spacers, even the tornado(true gimmick) work to improve power and mileage. I have witnessed dyno runs with these added have true improvement. Even an electric leaf blower will add power. The idea behind a TB spacer is used for slightly lengthening the runner prior to the intake runner. It is designed to improve torque. Intake spacers lower intake temps which is ideal for getting a denser charge. All of these will improve power.

Great advice Andrew!

Simply a bandaid and should not be recommended as a plausible repair.

Yes, I confirmed that they will be open.

A fully laoded Brat with A/C would go for $8787. I believe the price for A/C was $549. This price appears to be for an '82. http://www.indysworld.com/80s/brats/mags-acc/mag-index.html