Sweet82 Posted March 28, 2005 Share Posted March 28, 2005 Hey those of you with welded diffs, Do you ever drive on the street with them on a regular basis? (with both axles in) Just wondering how many folks get away with this or if it breaks axles everytime? What I'm getting at is, If your careful, can you get away with it with no ill effects? or is it just a repair waiting to happen? Looking for experience Glenn 82 SubaruHummer--Welded! 01 Forester--Limited. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stinky Posted March 28, 2005 Share Posted March 28, 2005 I've heard of people driving around on a welded diff with no problems, however it's just adding unnecessary strain to the driveline system, for the 10 minutes to put on/take off is it really worth it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Qman Posted March 28, 2005 Share Posted March 28, 2005 I have run welded and so have a number of our members from the Hatch Patrol. There have been no ill effects so far. As long as you make sure not to take very tight turns(read; steering wheel lock to lock) and do not get on the throttle while turning all should be fine. Granted it usually only takes 10-15 minutes to install one axle. Some just don't want to wait that long to play. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweet82 Posted March 28, 2005 Author Share Posted March 28, 2005 Where I was going with this post was, asphault is a lot like "slick rock". For Moab type usage of a welded diff, are you going to need to take as wide as turn as possible, to minimize the bind up on the drive train system? This may not work for the obsticle at hand. I was trying to ascess what might be a reasonable driving approach for welded diffs on slick rock. I was wondering if a tight turn might work with a burped throttle and a well timed hard crank on the wheel. This may allow the vehicle to unload the inside rear wheel momentarily and allow the slippage of the inside rear wheel in a tighter corner? Does the welded diff require more power because of the binding up of the driveline when manuvering? Glenn 82 SubaruHummer--Welded with one axle in. 01 Forester--LSD both axles in, thank you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subarutex Posted March 29, 2005 Share Posted March 29, 2005 I run a welded diff in my wagon. And frequently I'm too lazy to change out the axle. Mainly, this is spurred on by the fact that everyone ends up having to wait for me to install the axle at the trail head... and usually makes me feel bad. So, I regularly drive it on the street. To date, I've never broken an axle, I did break and axle stub once though. That was right after driving 400 miles hwy on it, and then piling 5 people in the car and trying to climb a stupid little rock pile. I find that the tires usually chirp if I turn to tight. Car is a little tougher to park in tight spots, and loses a little oomph going around some corners. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hooziewhatsit Posted March 29, 2005 Share Posted March 29, 2005 alright... maybe a silly question, but don't you need to install an axle stub (basically, from the CV joint to the castle nut) to hold the hub/tire on if you remove the entire axle? wouldn't this require jacking the car up to take stress off the axle? one more question :-) How do you remove the rear axle so fast? I heard from a local suby mechanic that the differential had to drop to remove them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rooinater Posted March 29, 2005 Share Posted March 29, 2005 i'd usually remove the axle when i wasn't lazy. the rest of the time i'd leave it in and drive for weeks. and i drive all crazy like. never broke anything in the rearend. (till i got a second t case). but like always yes in essance if you are beating on it on the pavement it is going to put wear and stress on it. someday down the road it probably will break in the slick rock. but if you are gentle as possible not right away. especially if you are just running the subaru tcase. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bushbasher Posted March 29, 2005 Share Posted March 29, 2005 alright... maybe a silly question, but don't you need to install an axle stub (basically, from the CV joint to the castle nut) to hold the hub/tire on if you remove the entire axle? wouldn't this require jacking the car up to take stress off the axle? one more question :-) How do you remove the rear axle so fast? I heard from a local suby mechanic that the differential had to drop to remove them? the rear cv axles have a seperate splined stub that goes through the hub. The outer cv slides off the splines on each end, leaving the stubs in the diff and hub. To remove an axle, the suspension must be all the way unloaded to give room for the axles to slide off the splines. Then you just take a 3/16 punch and knock out the roll pins on each end, wiggle the axle around and pull it off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hooziewhatsit Posted March 29, 2005 Share Posted March 29, 2005 the rear cv axles have a seperate splined stub that goes through the hub. The outer cv slides off the splines on each end, leaving the stubs in the diff and hub. To remove an axle, the suspension must be all the way unloaded to give room for the axles to slide off the splines. Then you just take a 3/16 punch and knock out the roll pins on each end, wiggle the axle around and pull it off. ohh yeeaaaaa.... thanks for the reply! now that you stated it, I do remember there are different axles in the rear. thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbone Posted March 29, 2005 Share Posted March 29, 2005 Any shop manual is invaluable, it can keep you from asking questions that may be embarassing :-p On that note, I have driven my Hatch(s) with a welded diff, on the street often. Just dont make u-turns. As for stabbing the throttle in certain situations, you might be asking for trouble. Mainly, this is spurred on by the fact that everyone ends up having to wait for me to install the axle at the trail head... and usually makes me feel bad. Thats because you take to long, Tex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweet82 Posted March 29, 2005 Author Share Posted March 29, 2005 I run a welded diff in my wagon. And frequently I'm too lazy to change out the axle. Mainly, this is spurred on by the fact that everyone ends up having to wait for me to install the axle at the trail head... and usually makes me feel bad. So, I regularly drive it on the street. To date, I've never broken an axle, I did break and axle stub once though. That was right after driving 400 miles hwy on it, and then piling 5 people in the car and trying to climb a stupid little rock pile. I find that the tires usually chirp if I turn to tight. Car is a little tougher to park in tight spots, and loses a little oomph going around some corners. I was wonder that? So in a corner is all your power going to be eaten up when your binding everything up? How bad is the bindup coming from the rear axles? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorganM Posted March 29, 2005 Share Posted March 29, 2005 Too much thinking about this; weld it up already and see if you like it or not. Lots and lots of people use rear AND front lockers on rocks. Worst that happens is you break something, limp back to the trailer, and have some tinkering to do back home. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rooinater Posted March 29, 2005 Share Posted March 29, 2005 he's right just weld it. if it breaks subaru parts are cheap. that's why we wheel them. just don't buy the parts from a junkyard in yuma, az. tha's rape..... but weld her drive her, keep the spare parts in the rig. that's all you need to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweet82 Posted March 29, 2005 Author Share Posted March 29, 2005 I've been welded since before the tube frame was even finished. It was one of the first things to happen. I'm just trying to get an feel for any tricks that may be out there for saving repairs on the trail. If there is a techinque that will allow me to not replace stubs on a regular basis, I want to hear it! Glenn, 82 SubaruHummer--welded, one axle removed. 01 Forester--LSD two axles installed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rooinater Posted March 30, 2005 Share Posted March 30, 2005 being gentle whenever possible, especially in high traction, high stress times. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subaru_dude Posted March 30, 2005 Share Posted March 30, 2005 Has anybody ever come up with the idea of somehow creating a locking rear diff that could more easily be locked and unlocked? Broncos have that, as do other serious off-road vehicles. thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bushbasher Posted March 30, 2005 Share Posted March 30, 2005 Has anybody ever come up with the idea of somehow creating a locking rear diff that could more easily be locked and unlocked? Broncos have that, as do other serious off-road vehicles. thanks the problem is the cost. A lot of people wheel broncos and other vehicles that share the same axles, so companies are willing to develop products for them. The community that wheels subarus seriously is still really small, and the hitachi r160 diff isnt available in any other car with a wheeling record. The other factor is that most hardcore suby wheelers need something stronger than the stock rear diff anyways, so why throw money into something with marginal strength. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
singletrack Posted March 30, 2005 Share Posted March 30, 2005 asphault is a lot like "slick rock". For Moab type usage of a welded diff, are you going to need to take as wide as turn as possible, to minimize the bind up on the drive train system? Hey I've had mine out on some extensive slickrock here in GJ, and the tires were more than willing to let out a satisfying "chirp" when turning. Made some tight lock-to-lock turns, etc. Time will tell, but it seems fine. Also seems logical to me that gassing it helps.... not over doing it of course, but enough to break the rear loose a little more. The more it chirps, the easier it is on the axles I would think. But what do I know, I've only been welded a month. This was on white rock, not the super high traction orange stuff. But close. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mudrat79 Posted March 30, 2005 Share Posted March 30, 2005 Glenn.... The Rear Of your Buggy is So light you should Have very little issue if any with Torque Bind In corners....Even with your Little Fatty tires, it should Unload the inside tire pretty easy..... Also out there on most of that Slick rock there is always a Skiff of sand blowing around, And that will give you a bit too..... Take spare parts, if you use them up , turn around head for the trailer , and Re-group....Don't you have anything remotely like Moab closer to you to try that Buggy on first...?? Later, Your Bud in Oregon..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rooinater Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 Has anybody ever come up with the idea of somehow creating a locking rear diff that could more easily be locked and unlocked? Broncos have that, as do other serious off-road vehicles. thanks it's not just the reliability and all of that of the r160. cause for most people a small locking diff in a slightly lifted subaru would be perfect. i and several others have tried to find support for getting them made. the fact of the matter is not enough people care enough, or have enough money to make it work. we have found several company's that would. but we'd have to find enough people for a backing to make prototypes and production. the offroad population has grown enough here over the last few years. it might be possible. but you'd have to find enough people to back it with $$ to make it work. start contacting the companies. i know i'll gladly back up for getting them. then i can get one in the front and rear of little roo!!.. that's if i don't sell her when her replacement comes in a few months... but whether i sell her or not, i'll definately buy some to help the process. just don't try any of the lsd companies..... i won't buy an lsd... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pinister Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 hi guys just smething to think about: i have a forester. viscose central diff and front and rear open diffs. i have recently installed a "phantomgrip", which is a limited slip kit, in my rear diff. i have installed it in spite of warnings about bad opinions (in a subaru forum in australia). it works great and i take "pinhead corners" much faster and quitely. this is a simple device that based on friction and works all the time, compering to other lsd that operate from a certain speed. the idea is to get help on and off-road. of course it isn't a full lock, but on the other hand it can be used on asphalt, and much better than without it. the next stage is to install one in the front diff, so, when i'll have two wheels in the air (diagonally), i'll still have the other two to pull me out (not such as a full lock, but much better then without it). just another way to improve the grip without risking mechanical parts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rooinater Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 it's still a limited slip... locked is really the only way to be when you are in really difficult terrain. a locker would be ideal but the welded is the best we got right now.Jared Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vegablade Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 is there any possiblility of welding a front diff. i havent heard much on this, my uncle said they had a little race car that they welded the diff on it and it helped a lot, he said he would do it for me. i have also driven a lot of 3 and 4 wheelers that have a locked rearend they do just fine on pavement if you can get them to slip a little to relieve the pressure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorganM Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 is there any possiblility of welding a front diff. i havent heard much on this, my uncle said they had a little race car that they welded the diff on it and it helped a lot, he said he would do it for me. i have also driven a lot of 3 and 4 wheelers that have a locked rearend they do just fine on pavement if you can get them to slip a little to relieve the pressure. Yes you can weld the front diff. Rough on the street though! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RavenTBK Posted April 1, 2005 Share Posted April 1, 2005 <edit> I know this has not that much to do with the current discussion, but since this is the current welded diff topic for the month, I figured I'd just add to this one. </edit> Random thought. What about a lunchbox locker style thing? A nifty little bar of steel that slides in and locks the spiders? Thats what a lot of us in the Bronco world use on the cheap. That would be something easy that could be installed/removed when needed. Not necessarily as fast as an axle is, but it would be a simple enough install that anybody could do, and gives the ability to go back to stock later. It could be built like it is in the Bronco world.. cheaply enough to where it would be the point of failure instead of axle/stub/whatever. What about that? Its something that Mudrat could produce in his shop... and/or Ozified could do.. :-\ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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